[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]Looks like am I about to be back [/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]I have been dating this girl for about 2 years, I wanted to see if things would work out and we could start a family. I am sure you guys know all the crap that goes along with that and It looks like I am about to end it with this one. The whole reason I started learning game was to find a good woman to start a family. [/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]This whole thing has got me thinking about my buddy. About 4 years ago he started dating a nerdy girl she was a 5.0 not fat but just plain nothing you would look twice at. Over the past 4 years he has " As he calls it trained her " To be the kind of woman he wants. There has been times we have all been out and she is a solid 6.0. She is cool to hang out with. She is not that hot but she is all most no trouble from what he tells me. Plus she makes up for what she lacks in looks in effort in the bedroom. He says it has taking some time but he is on his way to turning her in to the whore he wants. [/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]So the question is have any of you guys had any experience with girls like this? Can you take a 5.0 turn her in to 7.0 and keep her around or is it better to go for the girls that is are all ready 7.0 and up if you’re looking for something long term? I sure her wiliness to meet his needs has a lot to do with her seeing him as much higher value then her. What do you guys think - [/FONT][/COLOR]
Dallas PUA
The Pickup Artist Playground
Can you train a girl ?
1 post
• Page 1 of 1
by Guest » Wed Jul 13, 2011 10:13 am
All women can be trained. Shit, Game is all about 'training' women to act and comply in ways that you and HER both want. Yes, I said you and HER both want. Women want to please a man of high value and status. They want to make an Alpha male happy, to comply with his demands, to keep him interested in her, etc.
Every girl I've ever had an LTR with acted this way towards me. I trained them to look differently, to act differently, to please me sexually in ways that I wanted and demanded, etc.
There are techniques that allow you to train or, as I prefer to call it, groom a woman to act and look and perform and treat you the way you want. The best technique, by far, is to instill in them the feeling of dread over you not being a part of her life in any way, shape, or form. She has to feel as if she can lose you forever if she doesn't do exactly what it is that will make you happy as the high status, Alpha male that she views you as.
Understand that a woman will never comply to the demands of a Beta male because she's not really that afraid of losing him, so if you've find yourself in a relationship unfulfilled by the woman you're with despite your best efforts to get her to conform or comply with your demands then she simply doesn't view you as an Alpha male. You're Beta, you're one of a million, you're convenient or she's just accustom to you, and she'll bolt the first time an Alpha male shows her any level of attention. Keep in mind though that SOME women actually get tired of being with Alpha's and settle for a Beta male because they're tired of the anxiety that goes with trying to keep an Alpha OR they're roping in a guy to have kids with and/or to help her raise her children.
The fear of losing a man is simultaneously nerve racking and anxiety filled while also being incredibly erotic. Remember, women are in competition with each other and the prize is always an Alpha male, always. So, if everyday she goes to bed and you're "hers" then she feels a great sense of accomplishment and victory. But, the next morning the dread sets back in again. It's another day that she can lose you and she has got to do what it takes to make sure you don't leave her for someone prettier, younger, or better (however it is that you define 'better').
So, you've got to create the idea that she can lose you at any moment. That you can walk out that door, never look back, and no longer be a part of her life. And that in doing so you're moving on to bigger and better things, moving on to greener pastures. You don't need her. She's just a part of your life. She's just an add-on. These are the things she's got to believe, especially initially (you have to tone it down as the relationship progresses). She's got to believe that you're walking down the path of your life, that you're doing so with integrity and purpose, that she's not the sole existence of your being, and that you have bigger things to do than make her happy. In response, she'll try to make you deviate from your path. She'll try to make it so that she is the purpose of your life. She'll try to become the number one priority of your life. Her way of doing this is by trying to change into the type of girl that she thinks that you want. She'll try to become your dream girl in the hopes that you make her and her children the sole priority in your life. Your job is to never allow that to happen. That's the struggle, that's the game. She tries to tempt you, but you don't cave (at least not always).
But, how do you create this dynamic? We'll there are a ton of ways to do so. The first and easiest is to date a woman that is at least 2 notches below you. I've done this in the past and it's, quite frankly, the poor man's way of getting a woman to always comply with what you want from her. The downside to this is that if you're too good for her then she'll grow very, very paranoid and anxious about this fact. Her paranoia will eventually translate into rebellion and she'll find ways of trying to knock you down a couple of pegs to her 'level.'
This was the case with my last LTR. In pretty much every way imaginable I was better, for lack of a better term, than her. I'm smarter, more capable, wittier, more confident, more outgoing, have more education, made a lot more money than she did, the list goes on and on. At first, she complied with my demands without question. She changed her look, started working out more, changed her style, even got her nipples pierced and got more tats (because she knew I liked those things), she expanded her horizons in bed and did things with me that where clearly not something she would have done if it weren't for the fact that this much higher status, Alpha male was demanding it of her. She would degrade herself in ways that you can't imagine just to make ME happy.
But, over time, her awe of me turned into paranoia as it became clear that other people in our lives, i.e. friends and family, were aware of the difference in our Sexual Market Value. In a vacuum, she would have fooled herself into believing that we were on par, or at least close, but when her friends and family would say things like hold on to him, he's a catch, I'm impressed that you're dating someone like him, etc, etc, etc. then it just creates paranoia and frustration on her part. In response, she tried to prevent me from improving my value and even went as far as trying to get my value to fall. In other words, instead of increasing her value she wanted to pull mine closer to hers. I didn't comply for long, she left for a guy that's much, much more her speed and I'm sure she's happy as can be right now, albeit with a lesser male.
As you can see, picking women with much lower value has it's problems. Sure, you can try to get her increase her value but that's really up to her. Most people don't think about growing and improving, especially women, instead they think about getting others to regress. It's easier to be an albatross than to lift a weight. Simple as that. Women are also notorious for being lazy and unwilling to actually work. Improving your value requires work. My ex could have gone back to school, she could have read more, she could have tried to improve her lot in life, but she refused to do so because it required work. It's easy to change your look or get crazy in the bedroom but it's hard to actually improve your value as a person. Most women will try to rope you in and thwart your growth as a man than to try to do the work necessary to keep her value on par, or close, to yours.
On the other hand, I've been with two other women that were lower in value than I and they worked to improve their value (shed weight, went back to school, started a business, etc.). But, this has it's problems as well due to the hypergamous nature of women. If a 5 pulls a guy that's an 8 and she manages to improve herself to become a 7 during their relationship then she's very likely going to believe that she can do better. If I pulled an 8 when I was the way I was and now I'm way hotter, better off, have higher value, etc. then I should be with a 9 or even a 10. I deserve the best. That's how all women think.
My LTR before my most recent one worked exactly this way. She decided to get her MBA and started school in the Fall. By Christmas she had left me for a fellow student that had higher value than I possessed at the time. She traded up, her value grew faster than mine and she got empowered to do better for herself. During the break-up, she was not shy about this fact. That was a tough pill to swallow.
So, your question really should be how do I train a woman, help her improve her value, but still keep her. That's what we're really discussing here anyways.
Understand that all women date up. If you're an 8 then you're probably going to constantly pull 7s and below. Yes, you'll pull some 8s and up from time to time but I would contend that MOST of those women won't end up in a relationship with you. A woman has to feel like you're BETTER than her. She has to feel like she's accomplished the goal of getting a guy that's a real catch and, in women's jargon, a catch is someone superior to her. Plain and simple. A catch to a man is a woman that is a much more attractive woman than he is as a man. So, you've got to have as much value as you possibly can if you're going to snag the good ones.
Grooming or training a woman is something that can only really be done if a) she respects you b) she knows your value is higher than hers c) you're an Alpha male (in her eyes at least) and d) she has a healthy fear that you'll leave her for someone better.
To get a woman to respect you you have to show her that you have other things in your life that are important to you. You have passions, you have a purpose, you have more to your life than spending your time hanging out with her or getting drunk with your buddies at the bar. You have to pass her shit tests without hesistation on your part. Yove have to be willing to piss her off, to disagree with her, to stand up to her bullshit and petty little games. You have to be willing to walk away from her at any moment in time. You have to be willing to lose her without hesistation or regret.
You can communicate all of this over a few drinks on a day2. You talk about your exs, you tell her that you don't stay in touch with any of them, you tell her that once a relationship has run it's course then you don't see the need to keep her in your life, you tell her about a girl that you cared for very much but she did something [I usually say they cheated or lied or something along those lines] which gave you no choice but to leave. You forgive her for what she did, but your life is bound by your integrity and staying would have gone against everything that you believe and hold dear. Or tell her about something similar with a close buddy. Maybe he fucked a girl that you dated once and you feel that's petty and stupid so you ended the friendship. Or tell her about a time you were asked to do something underhanded or unethical at work and refused to perform said action and that doing so meant that you could lose your job. You get the idea. Create the frame that you're above it all. Make her think you have the answers. Sure, she may not agree with them but these are the right answers for the way you live your life. Women respect this type of thing, even if they don't see eye to eye. Explain all of this without apology. She'll test you on the things she disagrees with, don't back down. These are your answers, these are the things that are important to you, these are the things that absolutely cannot be compromised...for anything or any one.
You have to always, always, always improve your value. Every single relationship I've ever had I exited the relationship with a higher level of value than I did before I entered the relationship. If you're getting her to increase her value, then you have to increase your value as well so that she doesn't get the silly idea that she can do better. Understand that you could lose some women as you become a better man because they just don't want to increase their value or don't really know how to increase their value. That's what happened with my ex-LTR...then again, she had a son and was pretty well set in her ways. It was destined to fail.
You get a woman to comply with you after you've built the above foundation a) you're higher value than her b) your value is growing c) you can leave at any moment d) you're dominant and Alpha. Once you've created that dynamic, then you can begin to command things from her. What you need to be is a little birdie in her ear. Say things in passing, there's no need to address things specifically. She's on edge every moment of every day, she doesn't want to lose this high value, Alpha male that is willing to leave at a moment's notice, forever, if he isn't happy with her. So, she's going to listen for clues. She's going to probe you. My suggestion is to ignore the probes:
HB Grooming: "What turns you on..."
Bull Run: "Blumpkins..." Shit eating grin
HB Grooming: "Asshole..." She'll probably hit you and then she'll be disappointed inside because she just can't figure you out, she'll be turned on because you're mysterious, she'll be excited because you're unpredictable, she'll be eager to find out what it is that turns you on so she'll be primed for any clue to the answer.
Instead, say something in passing:
Watching TV together
Bull Run: "If Natalie Portman, from the movie Closer, had some tats and a piercing or two then I'd have like a bizillion of her babies..."
HB Grooming: Laughs. "You're out of control." She'll then make a note to herself. What does Natalie Portman from Closer look like? I didn't know he liked tats and piercings...I wonder what KIND.
While she's cooking
Bull Run: Come up behind her, whisper in her ear. "I was in a meeting today and I got this massive hard on thinking about cumming on your face...that sauce needs more salt."
HB Grooming: Blah, blah, blah. She'll think...hmm, he likes to cum on a woman's face. I can do that...
To train or groom a woman you have to be subtle. You're performing an operation here not chopping down a tree. Work around the edges. Start with the small stuff. If she wears a dress you don't like tell her that the next time she wears that you won't fuck her proper. On the other hand, if she does wear something you like, then show her right then and there. Fuck her before you ever leave the house. Fuck her before you go out. When she asks what got into you tell her that she looked super hot in that outfit. She'll start dressing more and more like that to make you happy. Punish her for not complying, reward her for complying. Think of her like a puppy. When they use the bathroom outside then they get a treat, a reward. When they do something wrong, they get punished (for women the best punishment is a threat of taking away your attention and affection from her OR actually doing so).
Getting compliance from a woman isn't difficult. It's actually pretty easy. What you have to understand is that she's now in the care of an Alpha male and, as such, she's going to expect that the Alpha male leads her. She's lost. She doesn't have direction, you give it to her. Again, you don't tell her what to do or how to do it (except in bed, then it's OK). Instead you nudge her. Don't pull on the leash, just a very subtle, slight tug. Then, give her the slack to go to where you want her to go. You have to lead her but she has to feel like it's her own idea.
Every girl I've ever had an LTR with acted this way towards me. I trained them to look differently, to act differently, to please me sexually in ways that I wanted and demanded, etc.
There are techniques that allow you to train or, as I prefer to call it, groom a woman to act and look and perform and treat you the way you want. The best technique, by far, is to instill in them the feeling of dread over you not being a part of her life in any way, shape, or form. She has to feel as if she can lose you forever if she doesn't do exactly what it is that will make you happy as the high status, Alpha male that she views you as.
Understand that a woman will never comply to the demands of a Beta male because she's not really that afraid of losing him, so if you've find yourself in a relationship unfulfilled by the woman you're with despite your best efforts to get her to conform or comply with your demands then she simply doesn't view you as an Alpha male. You're Beta, you're one of a million, you're convenient or she's just accustom to you, and she'll bolt the first time an Alpha male shows her any level of attention. Keep in mind though that SOME women actually get tired of being with Alpha's and settle for a Beta male because they're tired of the anxiety that goes with trying to keep an Alpha OR they're roping in a guy to have kids with and/or to help her raise her children.
The fear of losing a man is simultaneously nerve racking and anxiety filled while also being incredibly erotic. Remember, women are in competition with each other and the prize is always an Alpha male, always. So, if everyday she goes to bed and you're "hers" then she feels a great sense of accomplishment and victory. But, the next morning the dread sets back in again. It's another day that she can lose you and she has got to do what it takes to make sure you don't leave her for someone prettier, younger, or better (however it is that you define 'better').
So, you've got to create the idea that she can lose you at any moment. That you can walk out that door, never look back, and no longer be a part of her life. And that in doing so you're moving on to bigger and better things, moving on to greener pastures. You don't need her. She's just a part of your life. She's just an add-on. These are the things she's got to believe, especially initially (you have to tone it down as the relationship progresses). She's got to believe that you're walking down the path of your life, that you're doing so with integrity and purpose, that she's not the sole existence of your being, and that you have bigger things to do than make her happy. In response, she'll try to make you deviate from your path. She'll try to make it so that she is the purpose of your life. She'll try to become the number one priority of your life. Her way of doing this is by trying to change into the type of girl that she thinks that you want. She'll try to become your dream girl in the hopes that you make her and her children the sole priority in your life. Your job is to never allow that to happen. That's the struggle, that's the game. She tries to tempt you, but you don't cave (at least not always).
But, how do you create this dynamic? We'll there are a ton of ways to do so. The first and easiest is to date a woman that is at least 2 notches below you. I've done this in the past and it's, quite frankly, the poor man's way of getting a woman to always comply with what you want from her. The downside to this is that if you're too good for her then she'll grow very, very paranoid and anxious about this fact. Her paranoia will eventually translate into rebellion and she'll find ways of trying to knock you down a couple of pegs to her 'level.'
This was the case with my last LTR. In pretty much every way imaginable I was better, for lack of a better term, than her. I'm smarter, more capable, wittier, more confident, more outgoing, have more education, made a lot more money than she did, the list goes on and on. At first, she complied with my demands without question. She changed her look, started working out more, changed her style, even got her nipples pierced and got more tats (because she knew I liked those things), she expanded her horizons in bed and did things with me that where clearly not something she would have done if it weren't for the fact that this much higher status, Alpha male was demanding it of her. She would degrade herself in ways that you can't imagine just to make ME happy.
But, over time, her awe of me turned into paranoia as it became clear that other people in our lives, i.e. friends and family, were aware of the difference in our Sexual Market Value. In a vacuum, she would have fooled herself into believing that we were on par, or at least close, but when her friends and family would say things like hold on to him, he's a catch, I'm impressed that you're dating someone like him, etc, etc, etc. then it just creates paranoia and frustration on her part. In response, she tried to prevent me from improving my value and even went as far as trying to get my value to fall. In other words, instead of increasing her value she wanted to pull mine closer to hers. I didn't comply for long, she left for a guy that's much, much more her speed and I'm sure she's happy as can be right now, albeit with a lesser male.
As you can see, picking women with much lower value has it's problems. Sure, you can try to get her increase her value but that's really up to her. Most people don't think about growing and improving, especially women, instead they think about getting others to regress. It's easier to be an albatross than to lift a weight. Simple as that. Women are also notorious for being lazy and unwilling to actually work. Improving your value requires work. My ex could have gone back to school, she could have read more, she could have tried to improve her lot in life, but she refused to do so because it required work. It's easy to change your look or get crazy in the bedroom but it's hard to actually improve your value as a person. Most women will try to rope you in and thwart your growth as a man than to try to do the work necessary to keep her value on par, or close, to yours.
On the other hand, I've been with two other women that were lower in value than I and they worked to improve their value (shed weight, went back to school, started a business, etc.). But, this has it's problems as well due to the hypergamous nature of women. If a 5 pulls a guy that's an 8 and she manages to improve herself to become a 7 during their relationship then she's very likely going to believe that she can do better. If I pulled an 8 when I was the way I was and now I'm way hotter, better off, have higher value, etc. then I should be with a 9 or even a 10. I deserve the best. That's how all women think.
My LTR before my most recent one worked exactly this way. She decided to get her MBA and started school in the Fall. By Christmas she had left me for a fellow student that had higher value than I possessed at the time. She traded up, her value grew faster than mine and she got empowered to do better for herself. During the break-up, she was not shy about this fact. That was a tough pill to swallow.
So, your question really should be how do I train a woman, help her improve her value, but still keep her. That's what we're really discussing here anyways.
Understand that all women date up. If you're an 8 then you're probably going to constantly pull 7s and below. Yes, you'll pull some 8s and up from time to time but I would contend that MOST of those women won't end up in a relationship with you. A woman has to feel like you're BETTER than her. She has to feel like she's accomplished the goal of getting a guy that's a real catch and, in women's jargon, a catch is someone superior to her. Plain and simple. A catch to a man is a woman that is a much more attractive woman than he is as a man. So, you've got to have as much value as you possibly can if you're going to snag the good ones.
Grooming or training a woman is something that can only really be done if a) she respects you b) she knows your value is higher than hers c) you're an Alpha male (in her eyes at least) and d) she has a healthy fear that you'll leave her for someone better.
To get a woman to respect you you have to show her that you have other things in your life that are important to you. You have passions, you have a purpose, you have more to your life than spending your time hanging out with her or getting drunk with your buddies at the bar. You have to pass her shit tests without hesistation on your part. Yove have to be willing to piss her off, to disagree with her, to stand up to her bullshit and petty little games. You have to be willing to walk away from her at any moment in time. You have to be willing to lose her without hesistation or regret.
You can communicate all of this over a few drinks on a day2. You talk about your exs, you tell her that you don't stay in touch with any of them, you tell her that once a relationship has run it's course then you don't see the need to keep her in your life, you tell her about a girl that you cared for very much but she did something [I usually say they cheated or lied or something along those lines] which gave you no choice but to leave. You forgive her for what she did, but your life is bound by your integrity and staying would have gone against everything that you believe and hold dear. Or tell her about something similar with a close buddy. Maybe he fucked a girl that you dated once and you feel that's petty and stupid so you ended the friendship. Or tell her about a time you were asked to do something underhanded or unethical at work and refused to perform said action and that doing so meant that you could lose your job. You get the idea. Create the frame that you're above it all. Make her think you have the answers. Sure, she may not agree with them but these are the right answers for the way you live your life. Women respect this type of thing, even if they don't see eye to eye. Explain all of this without apology. She'll test you on the things she disagrees with, don't back down. These are your answers, these are the things that are important to you, these are the things that absolutely cannot be compromised...for anything or any one.
You have to always, always, always improve your value. Every single relationship I've ever had I exited the relationship with a higher level of value than I did before I entered the relationship. If you're getting her to increase her value, then you have to increase your value as well so that she doesn't get the silly idea that she can do better. Understand that you could lose some women as you become a better man because they just don't want to increase their value or don't really know how to increase their value. That's what happened with my ex-LTR...then again, she had a son and was pretty well set in her ways. It was destined to fail.
You get a woman to comply with you after you've built the above foundation a) you're higher value than her b) your value is growing c) you can leave at any moment d) you're dominant and Alpha. Once you've created that dynamic, then you can begin to command things from her. What you need to be is a little birdie in her ear. Say things in passing, there's no need to address things specifically. She's on edge every moment of every day, she doesn't want to lose this high value, Alpha male that is willing to leave at a moment's notice, forever, if he isn't happy with her. So, she's going to listen for clues. She's going to probe you. My suggestion is to ignore the probes:
HB Grooming: "What turns you on..."
Bull Run: "Blumpkins..." Shit eating grin
HB Grooming: "Asshole..." She'll probably hit you and then she'll be disappointed inside because she just can't figure you out, she'll be turned on because you're mysterious, she'll be excited because you're unpredictable, she'll be eager to find out what it is that turns you on so she'll be primed for any clue to the answer.
Instead, say something in passing:
Watching TV together
Bull Run: "If Natalie Portman, from the movie Closer, had some tats and a piercing or two then I'd have like a bizillion of her babies..."
HB Grooming: Laughs. "You're out of control." She'll then make a note to herself. What does Natalie Portman from Closer look like? I didn't know he liked tats and piercings...I wonder what KIND.
While she's cooking
Bull Run: Come up behind her, whisper in her ear. "I was in a meeting today and I got this massive hard on thinking about cumming on your face...that sauce needs more salt."
HB Grooming: Blah, blah, blah. She'll think...hmm, he likes to cum on a woman's face. I can do that...
To train or groom a woman you have to be subtle. You're performing an operation here not chopping down a tree. Work around the edges. Start with the small stuff. If she wears a dress you don't like tell her that the next time she wears that you won't fuck her proper. On the other hand, if she does wear something you like, then show her right then and there. Fuck her before you ever leave the house. Fuck her before you go out. When she asks what got into you tell her that she looked super hot in that outfit. She'll start dressing more and more like that to make you happy. Punish her for not complying, reward her for complying. Think of her like a puppy. When they use the bathroom outside then they get a treat, a reward. When they do something wrong, they get punished (for women the best punishment is a threat of taking away your attention and affection from her OR actually doing so).
Getting compliance from a woman isn't difficult. It's actually pretty easy. What you have to understand is that she's now in the care of an Alpha male and, as such, she's going to expect that the Alpha male leads her. She's lost. She doesn't have direction, you give it to her. Again, you don't tell her what to do or how to do it (except in bed, then it's OK). Instead you nudge her. Don't pull on the leash, just a very subtle, slight tug. Then, give her the slack to go to where you want her to go. You have to lead her but she has to feel like it's her own idea.
- Guest
by Guest » Fri Jul 15, 2011 12:06 am
You can't turn a 5 into a 7 (Are you a wizard? Can you perform magic?). 5's are invisible, you shouldn't even be considering dating a 5.
You can turn a 7 into solid relationship or marriage material. In fact, they are the perfect choices. They're pretty enough to make your dick hard, but they aren't so pretty as to have an entitled attitude (except in america the 7's still have that attitude). The most important traits in a woman are looks, youth, pleasantness, happiness, and a solid work ethic. I don't mean going to work at her high-powered law firm, I mean a willingness to cook, clean and do other household tasks. If she isn't willing to do those without complaint she ain't worth raising a family with.
Here are some hints she isn't worth a relationship:
[B]She shit-tests you from the get-go[/B]. Lot of guys will say "that's because she's so high value" but they're wrong. Girls who shit-test are losers. Pump and dumps. The girls who shit-test will always be on the lookout for her alpha white knight who will never arrive. Doesn't exist. But in her deluded, romance movie fueled mind he is still out there. Doesn't matter how old she gets, one day he will find her. Shit tests also show contempt for you from the get-go. Why reward her awful behavior with a LTR or more. Out of all the long term girlfriends I have had, only one has shit-tested me. Guess where she is today? Still a lonely, single, deluded, single mother who thinks she can make it as a famous singer.
[B]She has a bitch shield[/B]. Same thing as above. Girls with "bitch shields" turn out to be, you guessed it, bitches.
[B]She's fat[/B]. Duh. Pick a girl who can remain naturally slim, after your relationship or marriage she will put on a few pounds, not take off any weight.
[B]She doesn't smile much[/B]. If her face doesn't light up every time she sees you, pick another one. A smile is worth more than any college she went to, good job she has, car she drives or any of that other nonsense.
[B]She's a hippie, a drinker, a druggie, a feminist, an outspoken liberal, comes from a divorced family, has daddy issues, is over 30 (more like 27), is a shopaholic, is addicted to television, is a facebook status whore, expects or demands your money, has a high powered job like a lawyer, constantly eats junk food, has a messy home, or has a bad attitude. [/B]
BR posted a long post and I have to disagree with most of it, with a caveat. BR doesn't want marriage or a family so his goals are different from yours, Jast. He will be dating different kinds of women that aren't suitable for marriage. He advocates telling her what you demand, expect etc.. I advocate showing her. Talk is cheap and it doesn't mean anything. If you are ready to walk away at any moment you will never in your life have to say those words to a woman. She will know. Walking away is the easiest thing in the world to do. There are over 3 billion women in the world, there are probably 10 million women whom you will find attractive. She isn't a special princess, she isn't one in a million, she isn't your soul-mate. She's one of millions just like her.
A lot of what BR advocates is just plain unnecessary for the type of girl who is a keeper. If you pick a women like I have described above, a "good girl", a lot of your work will be done for you. With good girls it's never a fight for dominance.
Pick the right girl and minimal training is necessary. You cannot "alpha up" and turn a ho into a housewife. You cannot reverse the decades of training she has already had. "You can't teach an old dog new tricks". But you can teach a puppy everything. An inexperienced girl is the only type of girl who should ever be thought of as wife material. Inexperienced girls have an eagerness to please that makes training or grooming so much easier.
Frankly, I'm of the opinion that in the entire country there aren't women worthy of marriage. LTR's sure, only if they are your only options. [B]As PUA's you guys are searching for a tasty apple to eat. You're passing the Apple Orchard on your way to the rubbish bin looking for an edible apple.[/B]
You can turn a 7 into solid relationship or marriage material. In fact, they are the perfect choices. They're pretty enough to make your dick hard, but they aren't so pretty as to have an entitled attitude (except in america the 7's still have that attitude). The most important traits in a woman are looks, youth, pleasantness, happiness, and a solid work ethic. I don't mean going to work at her high-powered law firm, I mean a willingness to cook, clean and do other household tasks. If she isn't willing to do those without complaint she ain't worth raising a family with.
Here are some hints she isn't worth a relationship:
[B]She shit-tests you from the get-go[/B]. Lot of guys will say "that's because she's so high value" but they're wrong. Girls who shit-test are losers. Pump and dumps. The girls who shit-test will always be on the lookout for her alpha white knight who will never arrive. Doesn't exist. But in her deluded, romance movie fueled mind he is still out there. Doesn't matter how old she gets, one day he will find her. Shit tests also show contempt for you from the get-go. Why reward her awful behavior with a LTR or more. Out of all the long term girlfriends I have had, only one has shit-tested me. Guess where she is today? Still a lonely, single, deluded, single mother who thinks she can make it as a famous singer.
[B]She has a bitch shield[/B]. Same thing as above. Girls with "bitch shields" turn out to be, you guessed it, bitches.
[B]She's fat[/B]. Duh. Pick a girl who can remain naturally slim, after your relationship or marriage she will put on a few pounds, not take off any weight.
[B]She doesn't smile much[/B]. If her face doesn't light up every time she sees you, pick another one. A smile is worth more than any college she went to, good job she has, car she drives or any of that other nonsense.
[B]She's a hippie, a drinker, a druggie, a feminist, an outspoken liberal, comes from a divorced family, has daddy issues, is over 30 (more like 27), is a shopaholic, is addicted to television, is a facebook status whore, expects or demands your money, has a high powered job like a lawyer, constantly eats junk food, has a messy home, or has a bad attitude. [/B]
BR posted a long post and I have to disagree with most of it, with a caveat. BR doesn't want marriage or a family so his goals are different from yours, Jast. He will be dating different kinds of women that aren't suitable for marriage. He advocates telling her what you demand, expect etc.. I advocate showing her. Talk is cheap and it doesn't mean anything. If you are ready to walk away at any moment you will never in your life have to say those words to a woman. She will know. Walking away is the easiest thing in the world to do. There are over 3 billion women in the world, there are probably 10 million women whom you will find attractive. She isn't a special princess, she isn't one in a million, she isn't your soul-mate. She's one of millions just like her.
A lot of what BR advocates is just plain unnecessary for the type of girl who is a keeper. If you pick a women like I have described above, a "good girl", a lot of your work will be done for you. With good girls it's never a fight for dominance.
Pick the right girl and minimal training is necessary. You cannot "alpha up" and turn a ho into a housewife. You cannot reverse the decades of training she has already had. "You can't teach an old dog new tricks". But you can teach a puppy everything. An inexperienced girl is the only type of girl who should ever be thought of as wife material. Inexperienced girls have an eagerness to please that makes training or grooming so much easier.
Frankly, I'm of the opinion that in the entire country there aren't women worthy of marriage. LTR's sure, only if they are your only options. [B]As PUA's you guys are searching for a tasty apple to eat. You're passing the Apple Orchard on your way to the rubbish bin looking for an edible apple.[/B]
- Guest
by Guest » Fri Jul 15, 2011 9:30 am
I think Lion's assessment is pretty spot on. I came from the perspective, rightfully so, that pretty much all women (especially in the western world) are not worthy of marriage. Virtually all of them are tainted and overly entitled. Sluts, all of them. Therefore, when you act like a slut guess what? I treat you like a slut. Act like a child, get treated like a child.
As for the inexperienced woman, I agree that there is no battle for dominance. She's still in touch with her feminine side enought to understand that, as the man, you are inherently the dominant one. She understands that it's a battle she cannot fight and doesn't want to fight. She enjoys being a woman, she enjoys taking care of her man and their family, that's her role and her job and she should take to it with vigor.
In the end, the vast majority of women in our culture will require training. You will always be in a never ending battle for dominance and supremacy in your relationship. You will never really stop Gaming her...as such one or both of you will get burned out in time (been there, done that). For the rare few that are marriage material, most of your work will be done for you. The only issue is that of all of the women I've met and been with over the years I can say with complete confidence that only 2 were the inexperienced pups. The rest were just old dogs trying desperately to rope in a man while she's young and beautiful but never really being satisified with what she has because he's either too Alpha (she can't be dominant) or too Beta (seeking the Alpha White Knight). They're never happy with what they have, never.
As for the inexperienced woman, I agree that there is no battle for dominance. She's still in touch with her feminine side enought to understand that, as the man, you are inherently the dominant one. She understands that it's a battle she cannot fight and doesn't want to fight. She enjoys being a woman, she enjoys taking care of her man and their family, that's her role and her job and she should take to it with vigor.
In the end, the vast majority of women in our culture will require training. You will always be in a never ending battle for dominance and supremacy in your relationship. You will never really stop Gaming her...as such one or both of you will get burned out in time (been there, done that). For the rare few that are marriage material, most of your work will be done for you. The only issue is that of all of the women I've met and been with over the years I can say with complete confidence that only 2 were the inexperienced pups. The rest were just old dogs trying desperately to rope in a man while she's young and beautiful but never really being satisified with what she has because he's either too Alpha (she can't be dominant) or too Beta (seeking the Alpha White Knight). They're never happy with what they have, never.
- Guest
by Guest » Fri Jul 15, 2011 11:30 am
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana][COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]I don’t think I have ever found a woman that I did not have to game. They always have some kind of shit test, bitch shield, ect. I just accept it as the norm now. It never occurred to me to take them as signs that this girl was not suitable to start a family with. I always just put the blame on me and my skill set not being up to par to keep things going how I want. That makes me think maybe I need to start looking for girls in different places. Where are the places to go with good odds of finding “Good Girls” - Off the top of my head I can think of maybe some kind of church setting. But Like Lion said there may not be any in the USA Fuck knows I have never meet one.... I may have better luck catching a unicorn.[/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana][/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]Another thing I have been thinking about is game long term. A lot of the things I do to get a girl at first don’t work good later in a LTR. They work great to ge met laid or to get a few girls to juggle around but for a LTR it just lead to burn out on both sides like BR said. In this last LTR I backed off acting really Alpha so my girl was not always so anxiety filled about losing me and had some security in the LTR. I may have done it too much because now the LTR is just boring. I have been thinking about just laying out things I need her to do to stay in this LTR and seeing how that goes its going down in flames anyway. I can only think of 2 outcomes 1 She submits to the demands or 2 She does not and we end it. I know she does not want to lose me but she does not have any drive on her own to try and please me. Hints don’t work with this girl and the only thing I got left is to be direct. [/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana][/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]But after reading Lions post do I really want to spend any more time with a girl that I would have to do that with? Does she have to many personal problems to work on - Also is the current problem have more to do with me and things I need to work on or more to do with me picking a girl not suitable to what I want? I know some woman are just fucking crazy and nothing you do will keep them happy for long but what about the girls were thing just seemed to kind of fall apart. Do you guys usually find that more to be a problem with your skill set or with girl - [/FONT][/COLOR]
[/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana][/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]Another thing I have been thinking about is game long term. A lot of the things I do to get a girl at first don’t work good later in a LTR. They work great to ge met laid or to get a few girls to juggle around but for a LTR it just lead to burn out on both sides like BR said. In this last LTR I backed off acting really Alpha so my girl was not always so anxiety filled about losing me and had some security in the LTR. I may have done it too much because now the LTR is just boring. I have been thinking about just laying out things I need her to do to stay in this LTR and seeing how that goes its going down in flames anyway. I can only think of 2 outcomes 1 She submits to the demands or 2 She does not and we end it. I know she does not want to lose me but she does not have any drive on her own to try and please me. Hints don’t work with this girl and the only thing I got left is to be direct. [/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana][/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]But after reading Lions post do I really want to spend any more time with a girl that I would have to do that with? Does she have to many personal problems to work on - Also is the current problem have more to do with me and things I need to work on or more to do with me picking a girl not suitable to what I want? I know some woman are just fucking crazy and nothing you do will keep them happy for long but what about the girls were thing just seemed to kind of fall apart. Do you guys usually find that more to be a problem with your skill set or with girl - [/FONT][/COLOR]
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- Guest
by Guest » Mon Jul 18, 2011 9:39 am
Little late to the party... but, this is an interesting topic and some of the replies as always have great depth.
I'm a big believer of training people how you WANT to be treated, but at the same time if you study NLP and how the brain works you also realize that any one persons programming that leads to habits is literally carved into their brain. It takes so much effort to even program ourselves. See the effort here. The key component I see here is setting a guideline from the beginning about how you want to be treated and if she can't meet that standard then no go.
You should easily be able to find women that are 7s or better to settle down with. My advice is to develop criteria. The women I party, sleep, and associate with don't have anything to do with settling down.
My secret success for settling down women have been the hot exotic foreign girl. They usually appreciate the simple things in life and even have a more solid family foundation in their lives. Keep in mind this isn't 100%, but it's pretty fucking awesome as the art of taking care of your man in a traditional way is hard to find in US.
In the US, I look for a few things. Highly educated women that are well cultured or small town value girls.
Personally when I meet these type of women it's away from the club. If it's at the club they got dragged out or are meeting social obligations.
Don't get discouraged.. I find so many of my friends feel the same way, but they keep doing the same thing. Still do the club thing... but, I keep telling them to open up their lives and stop going to the same watering hole. Do some meetup groups and look for these women at high value cultural events and hobbies. If you meet the perfect woman and she lives in New Orleans don't just blow it off. I've got a 37 year old buddy that did this. Just make sure you know what the perfect woman is and know that your life is centered.
Sorry about your investment with this ex or soon to be ex. Lift your head up and you'll be okay. I started back in pick up the same way. Felt like I was in a rut for awhile, but came back and was an unstoppable force. It was like I had some secret mojo or something. Really hope you find the same.
I'm a big believer of training people how you WANT to be treated, but at the same time if you study NLP and how the brain works you also realize that any one persons programming that leads to habits is literally carved into their brain. It takes so much effort to even program ourselves. See the effort here. The key component I see here is setting a guideline from the beginning about how you want to be treated and if she can't meet that standard then no go.
You should easily be able to find women that are 7s or better to settle down with. My advice is to develop criteria. The women I party, sleep, and associate with don't have anything to do with settling down.
My secret success for settling down women have been the hot exotic foreign girl. They usually appreciate the simple things in life and even have a more solid family foundation in their lives. Keep in mind this isn't 100%, but it's pretty fucking awesome as the art of taking care of your man in a traditional way is hard to find in US.
In the US, I look for a few things. Highly educated women that are well cultured or small town value girls.
Personally when I meet these type of women it's away from the club. If it's at the club they got dragged out or are meeting social obligations.
Don't get discouraged.. I find so many of my friends feel the same way, but they keep doing the same thing. Still do the club thing... but, I keep telling them to open up their lives and stop going to the same watering hole. Do some meetup groups and look for these women at high value cultural events and hobbies. If you meet the perfect woman and she lives in New Orleans don't just blow it off. I've got a 37 year old buddy that did this. Just make sure you know what the perfect woman is and know that your life is centered.
Sorry about your investment with this ex or soon to be ex. Lift your head up and you'll be okay. I started back in pick up the same way. Felt like I was in a rut for awhile, but came back and was an unstoppable force. It was like I had some secret mojo or something. Really hope you find the same.
- Guest
by Guest » Mon Jul 18, 2011 9:54 am
Wanted to add:
Props to Bull and Lion. I like their responses.
I agree with Bull about the subtle programming, but I also like to find the right type and don't like having to do tons of work. That being said... totally f'ing fell hard for my current girl, but I'd love to train her in the bedroom. Being the 2nd man in her life and me having been a womanizer is personally a fucking mind job. Sometimes I just have to be suuuper patient.
I don't know if I've ever made posts here about it. But, I used to be an expert at finding girls that I called rookies. These were high value women that didn't see their value. Which is nice. They were the nerd hiding behind glasses that looked like a 6 or 7 that really were a screaming 10. Or the girl that needed to drop 20lbs. They are worth investing time in and I found that they were so loyal if you found them in this condition and "trained" them. Or accepted who they were and appreciated the "hidden" value.
Props to Bull and Lion. I like their responses.
I agree with Bull about the subtle programming, but I also like to find the right type and don't like having to do tons of work. That being said... totally f'ing fell hard for my current girl, but I'd love to train her in the bedroom. Being the 2nd man in her life and me having been a womanizer is personally a fucking mind job. Sometimes I just have to be suuuper patient.
I don't know if I've ever made posts here about it. But, I used to be an expert at finding girls that I called rookies. These were high value women that didn't see their value. Which is nice. They were the nerd hiding behind glasses that looked like a 6 or 7 that really were a screaming 10. Or the girl that needed to drop 20lbs. They are worth investing time in and I found that they were so loyal if you found them in this condition and "trained" them. Or accepted who they were and appreciated the "hidden" value.
- Guest
by Guest » Mon Sep 19, 2011 1:22 pm
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]Guys, [/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]I just wanted to give a update on how things are going with my LTR and get your advice on a few things. Just to recap I have been with this woman over 2 years and things have started to take a turn for the worst. It got to the point where I was about to end it, I just did not give a fuck any more.[/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana] [/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]I sat her down and laid it all out for her but I did not dump her I gave he a choice. Either she steps up and becomes the woman I want or I walk. I never figured crap like that would work. Funny thing is so far it has worked great things are going good. I know it has only been 2 months and I have no clue if this will last. That’s what I want to know has any one else had any experience in a scenario like this and if so what was your outcome and what advice do you have - [/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]I just wanted to give a update on how things are going with my LTR and get your advice on a few things. Just to recap I have been with this woman over 2 years and things have started to take a turn for the worst. It got to the point where I was about to end it, I just did not give a fuck any more.[/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana] [/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=black][FONT=Verdana]I sat her down and laid it all out for her but I did not dump her I gave he a choice. Either she steps up and becomes the woman I want or I walk. I never figured crap like that would work. Funny thing is so far it has worked great things are going good. I know it has only been 2 months and I have no clue if this will last. That’s what I want to know has any one else had any experience in a scenario like this and if so what was your outcome and what advice do you have - [/FONT][/COLOR]
- Guest
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