Hey guys, haven't been here in a long while. Good to see this place is still alive and well. I'll try to make it out for one of the upcoming Friday night things.
I think I finally diagnosed my own game and got something figured out. I think the "game" and how you play it is very different for me, and probably a few other guys.
Women always tell me I'm hot. I get it all the time. Because of that, I think I have to play the game differently. I'm new to this "being the hot guy" thing...I've done a ton of self improvement things, mainly diet and gym, and I think my brain has finally started to catch up with my body and the way I look for the last year or so. I haven't always been the hot guy.
For me, the reason I haven't been able to pull same night lays, and still struggle big time, is because I keep getting myself thrown into the cocky category and, trust me, [B]women RUN from the cocky hot guy.[/B] Cocky = bad.
[B]If women routinely say "you're hot" your worst enemy is COCKY.[/B]
There's no reason to be cocky and funny if you already have attraction. Cocky AND funny, according to DeAngelo, is gold, but I keep leaving the funny part out. And I keep getting blown out for being cocky.
So I started experimenting over the last few weeks with total fucking mr nice guy approach. I intentionally started breaking the rules. I've started saying things like "I just don't understand women." And, "I just want to meet [I]one [/I]hot girl who acts like an ugly girl." "I think you are really sexy, and do you know why I say that?" (Then I go into things like confident body language, beautiful hair, skin...whatever.) And "If I have to go through another weekend like this one, I don't know what I'll do"...they ask why...and I hem and haw and eventually they hear me say "I just feel really lonely lately."
In the past, I've sworn never to compliment a woman's beauty, or give much indication that I was willing to make more investment then her. I've always tried to wait for her to indicate a sign of attraction before I'd escalate kino...shit like that. Stupid little rules that all sub-communicate "My life is so awesome, I'm a social king, I don't know if I'd have time for you or even be attracted enough for anything past a one night fuck." For me, this just doesn't work very well, especially with 20-something women.
Maybe when you're a normal looking guy, the cocky attitude can generate attraction if you're able to not fuck it up by also being funny at the same time. For me, that's like mission impossible. But when you already have attraction, cocky fucks everything up and they run. Over the last year, I have blown more opportunities than I can count because of being cocky.
Fuck the rules. They don't seem to work for me. My best game is to indicate I'm looking to meet someone special, I'm frustrated with my lack of success with women and basically play the wounded duck role. More aggression in phone game seems to work really well with younger women in their 20's. I think the younger they are, the more I need to be aggressive and chase. The older women will chase me, it's not much of a challenge as long as I avoid the cocky category. But the younger women, I used to think they weren't attracted to me, therefore, they didn't chase hard. But now I think it's just that they are younger, and therefore, less self confident, which makes them way less likely to chase.
I think women have this fantasy that the guy they meet, who sweeps them off their feet, is TOTALLY into them, "From the very beginning, he knew we were soul mates" That might explain why so many of them act like they don't give a fuck in phone game...they're testing to see if you're the guy who will try hard because you "knew we we're soul mates". So if you meet a girl, and get her number, I think, for me, more aggressive in phone game, more desperate, trying harder, is better. At least, I'm gonna try it. I think if you're the hot guy, even though I might give strong chase from the beginning, and act like I'm kinda desperate, they know deep down, that I'm still a challenge.
Anyway, just thought I'd write this up. I've been breaking just about every rule I thought I had learned over the last few years and I am getting much better results than ever before.
I think I'm on the verge of getting with some really, really hot women...something that has eluded me my entire life. I just feel that I'm onto something. Maybe it's just my brain finally catching up with my body/looks.
Don't get me wrong...my game is still a complete fucking disaster...women flake on me, I rarely pull SNL's, I freeze up around really beautiful women...but I really think I'm onto something with mr clueless nice guy. I think I'm about to start getting much better success.
Dallas PUA
The Pickup Artist Playground
I think I figured something out about my game
18 posts
• Page 1 of 2 • 1, 2
by Guest » Tue Apr 06, 2010 4:10 pm
One quick bit of advice for you:
If the mister nice guy approach worked there would be no reason for this forum or any like it.
Instead of playing the wounded duck why don't you work on the humor aspect? You're 2/3 of the way there. Maybe take a comedy improv class, or just have 15-20 hilarious things to say in your arsenal.
Cocky/Funny is the best thing you can do. If you're seeing success with Mr. Nice Guy I would bet you'll start getting some LJBF's in a couple weeks. It isn't sustainable unless you want to be dominated by women. In which case you're going about it the right way.
Humor, just like anything else, can be learned. Give it a shot.
If the mister nice guy approach worked there would be no reason for this forum or any like it.
Instead of playing the wounded duck why don't you work on the humor aspect? You're 2/3 of the way there. Maybe take a comedy improv class, or just have 15-20 hilarious things to say in your arsenal.
Cocky/Funny is the best thing you can do. If you're seeing success with Mr. Nice Guy I would bet you'll start getting some LJBF's in a couple weeks. It isn't sustainable unless you want to be dominated by women. In which case you're going about it the right way.
Humor, just like anything else, can be learned. Give it a shot.
- Guest
by Guest » Tue Apr 06, 2010 4:25 pm
I'm definitely not getting LJBF'd at all.
Once I make it past the bitch shield, and get myself into the circle of trust, I'm good. It's getting past the bitch shield that's always been my problem...along with approach anxiety. I have no problem with leading women, usually.
I'm just gonna try to eliminate any trace of cocky/hard-to-get from my game, try it out and see if it keeps working. So far, it's been really good. Once I lay them, I tend to get pretty cocky. At the end of the day, being an ass is pretty natural for me.
I'll give some feedback on how it's working as I continue to test it out. You're right, it is contrary to everything being taught in the seduction community.
Once I make it past the bitch shield, and get myself into the circle of trust, I'm good. It's getting past the bitch shield that's always been my problem...along with approach anxiety. I have no problem with leading women, usually.
I'm just gonna try to eliminate any trace of cocky/hard-to-get from my game, try it out and see if it keeps working. So far, it's been really good. Once I lay them, I tend to get pretty cocky. At the end of the day, being an ass is pretty natural for me.
I'll give some feedback on how it's working as I continue to test it out. You're right, it is contrary to everything being taught in the seduction community.
- Guest
by Guest » Tue Apr 06, 2010 4:39 pm
[QUOTE=Lion;35647]One quick bit of advice for you:
If the mister nice guy approach worked there would be no reason for this forum or any like it.
Instead of playing the wounded duck why don't you work on the humor aspect? You're 2/3 of the way there. Maybe take a comedy improv class, or just have 15-20 hilarious things to say in your arsenal.
Cocky/Funny is the best thing you can do. If you're seeing success with Mr. Nice Guy I would bet you'll start getting some LJBF's in a couple weeks. It isn't sustainable unless you want to be dominated by women. In which case you're going about it the right way.
Humor, just like anything else, can be learned. Give it a shot.[/QUOTE]
100% agree. Nothing diffuses a situtation better than a little humor. Cocky/funny is by far the best way to deal with women.
Having said that, have you considered that maybe you're approaching and Gaming women that, to put it bluntly, are not in your league? Is it possible that these women aren't all that attractive? Women don't hate the attractive, cocky guy...they hate the cocky guy that's too attractive for them.
If the mister nice guy approach worked there would be no reason for this forum or any like it.
Instead of playing the wounded duck why don't you work on the humor aspect? You're 2/3 of the way there. Maybe take a comedy improv class, or just have 15-20 hilarious things to say in your arsenal.
Cocky/Funny is the best thing you can do. If you're seeing success with Mr. Nice Guy I would bet you'll start getting some LJBF's in a couple weeks. It isn't sustainable unless you want to be dominated by women. In which case you're going about it the right way.
Humor, just like anything else, can be learned. Give it a shot.[/QUOTE]
100% agree. Nothing diffuses a situtation better than a little humor. Cocky/funny is by far the best way to deal with women.
Having said that, have you considered that maybe you're approaching and Gaming women that, to put it bluntly, are not in your league? Is it possible that these women aren't all that attractive? Women don't hate the attractive, cocky guy...they hate the cocky guy that's too attractive for them.
- Guest
by Guest » Tue Apr 06, 2010 5:54 pm
[QUOTE=Alphagame;35646]So I started experimenting over the last few weeks with total fucking mr nice guy approach. I intentionally started breaking the rules. I've started saying things like "I just don't understand women." And, "I just want to meet [I]one [/I]hot girl who acts like an ugly girl." "I think you are really sexy, and do you know why I say that?" (Then I go into things like confident body language, beautiful hair, skin...whatever.) And "If I have to go through another weekend like this one, I don't know what I'll do"...they ask why...and I hem and haw and eventually they hear me say "I just feel really lonely lately."[/QUOTE]
It looks like you've been experimenting with Juggler Method. I think it's the first chapter where he suggests saying, "I'm really enjoying talking to you, but I'm kinda shy." What you're doing is classic Juggler (DQs and SOIs).
[quote]Fuck the rules. They don't seem to work for me. My best game is to indicate I'm looking to meet someone special, I'm frustrated with my lack of success with women and basically play the wounded duck role. More aggression in phone game seems to work really well with younger women in their 20's. I think the younger they are, the more I need to be aggressive and chase. The older women will chase me, it's not much of a challenge as long as I avoid the cocky category. But the younger women, I used to think they weren't attracted to me, therefore, they didn't chase hard. But now I think it's just that they are younger, and therefore, less self confident, which makes them way less likely to chase.[/quote]
It's ok to be aggressive in phone game as long as she's contributing. If you call and she answers and carries on 50% of the conversation, then you aren't really being aggressive or being mr. super nice guy; you're just being a normal (non-AFC) guy.
[quote]I think women have this fantasy that the guy they meet, who sweeps them off their feet, is TOTALLY into them, "From the very beginning, he knew we were soul mates" That might explain why so many of them act like they don't give a fuck in phone game...they're testing to see if you're the guy who will try hard because you "knew we we're soul mates". So if you meet a girl, and get her number, I think, for me, more aggressive in phone game, more desperate, trying harder, is better. At least, I'm gonna try it. I think if you're the hot guy, even though I might give strong chase from the beginning, and act like I'm kinda desperate, they know deep down, that I'm still a challenge.[/quote]
Ok, don't go overboard. There's a way to be aggressive and still not be desperate. You have to give her opportunities to give of herself. You have to let her pursue you back.
I definitely recommend you look into Charisma Arts. It might just be that cocky/funny doesn't work for you, but Juggler Method does.
It looks like you've been experimenting with Juggler Method. I think it's the first chapter where he suggests saying, "I'm really enjoying talking to you, but I'm kinda shy." What you're doing is classic Juggler (DQs and SOIs).
[quote]Fuck the rules. They don't seem to work for me. My best game is to indicate I'm looking to meet someone special, I'm frustrated with my lack of success with women and basically play the wounded duck role. More aggression in phone game seems to work really well with younger women in their 20's. I think the younger they are, the more I need to be aggressive and chase. The older women will chase me, it's not much of a challenge as long as I avoid the cocky category. But the younger women, I used to think they weren't attracted to me, therefore, they didn't chase hard. But now I think it's just that they are younger, and therefore, less self confident, which makes them way less likely to chase.[/quote]
It's ok to be aggressive in phone game as long as she's contributing. If you call and she answers and carries on 50% of the conversation, then you aren't really being aggressive or being mr. super nice guy; you're just being a normal (non-AFC) guy.
[quote]I think women have this fantasy that the guy they meet, who sweeps them off their feet, is TOTALLY into them, "From the very beginning, he knew we were soul mates" That might explain why so many of them act like they don't give a fuck in phone game...they're testing to see if you're the guy who will try hard because you "knew we we're soul mates". So if you meet a girl, and get her number, I think, for me, more aggressive in phone game, more desperate, trying harder, is better. At least, I'm gonna try it. I think if you're the hot guy, even though I might give strong chase from the beginning, and act like I'm kinda desperate, they know deep down, that I'm still a challenge.[/quote]
Ok, don't go overboard. There's a way to be aggressive and still not be desperate. You have to give her opportunities to give of herself. You have to let her pursue you back.
I definitely recommend you look into Charisma Arts. It might just be that cocky/funny doesn't work for you, but Juggler Method does.
- Guest
by Guest » Tue Apr 06, 2010 7:01 pm
I think you should give what you wrote a shot. It may very well work for you. You have elevated yourself in a manner that most girls now view themselves lower than you. You are on the pedestal for 80%+ of girls.
Getting good at game is about trying new things. Implement what works and put the rest on the back burner. Plus you can't game every single girl the same. You must gauge them so you can adjust to them.
Getting good at game is about trying new things. Implement what works and put the rest on the back burner. Plus you can't game every single girl the same. You must gauge them so you can adjust to them.
- Guest
by Guest » Wed Apr 07, 2010 8:20 am
Just to kind of blatantly point out what Lion and Bull Run were agreeing on...
The reason why Cocky/Funny is referred to as Cocky/Funny is because you use one WITH the other. You're funny to offset the slight asshole-ish vibe being cocky can push out, and you're cocky to offset the "dancing monkey" factor of being funny.
The reason why Cocky/Funny is referred to as Cocky/Funny is because you use one WITH the other. You're funny to offset the slight asshole-ish vibe being cocky can push out, and you're cocky to offset the "dancing monkey" factor of being funny.
- Guest
by Guest » Wed Apr 07, 2010 10:07 am
[QUOTE=Alphagame;35649] At the end of the day, being an ass is pretty natural for me.
[/QUOTE]
Perhaps this is the reason why laying off the cocky and being a little nicer might work for you???
No doubt that being cocky/funny works in most cases but I'm not so sure if its as effective for the personality types who are already on the dick-ish/asshole/cocky side as it is for the humble/modest personality types.
I'm also naturally cocky and assholish and get called out on it often. Some girls like, it some don't. But they are always enticed when I show them a glimpse of the "sweet" guy underneath the unyielding outer surface.
I've noticed that whatever I am wearing has a lot to do with how I am initially perceived. Dressing like a cocky-asshole when you naturally are one can be a bit overbearing. Some girls will fear you and want nothing to do with you. Those are usually the weaker personalities! Strong personalities tend to attract others with strong personalities. What kind of girl do you want? Birds of a feather flock together comes to mind.
It still comes down to calibrating to your audience so you are perceived in a manner in which you want to be portrayed as a result of your appearance and language. And in the end, just be yo' self! No need to waste someones time pretending to be someone you aren't. Sometimes I say the hell with all of this fancy PUA tricks and theories bullshit.
[/QUOTE]
Perhaps this is the reason why laying off the cocky and being a little nicer might work for you???
No doubt that being cocky/funny works in most cases but I'm not so sure if its as effective for the personality types who are already on the dick-ish/asshole/cocky side as it is for the humble/modest personality types.
I'm also naturally cocky and assholish and get called out on it often. Some girls like, it some don't. But they are always enticed when I show them a glimpse of the "sweet" guy underneath the unyielding outer surface.
I've noticed that whatever I am wearing has a lot to do with how I am initially perceived. Dressing like a cocky-asshole when you naturally are one can be a bit overbearing. Some girls will fear you and want nothing to do with you. Those are usually the weaker personalities! Strong personalities tend to attract others with strong personalities. What kind of girl do you want? Birds of a feather flock together comes to mind.
It still comes down to calibrating to your audience so you are perceived in a manner in which you want to be portrayed as a result of your appearance and language. And in the end, just be yo' self! No need to waste someones time pretending to be someone you aren't. Sometimes I say the hell with all of this fancy PUA tricks and theories bullshit.
- Guest
by Guest » Wed Apr 07, 2010 10:50 am
[QUOTE=Alphagame;35646] Don't get me wrong...my game is still a complete fucking disaster...women flake on me, I rarely pull SNL's, I freeze up around really beautiful women...but I really think I'm onto something with mr clueless nice guy. I think I'm about to start getting much better success.[/QUOTE]
Sonds to me like your perspectives on what women find atractive about you are either a little off or completely wrong alltogether. You know what you are interested in... LOOKS! So in your eyes you have elevated your game, but you might have only elevated your looks. As far as most women are concerned physical atraction is only part of it and not even the biggest part. You weren't striking out because you were being cocky, you were striking out because you were being cocky to compensate for your insecurity. Women are very intuitive about these things. Take it from me and my own personal struggles with this area. Your mind/personality have not quite caught up to your new body yet. I have at different times worked tirelessly on my "shortcomings" only to find I out some of these things didn't really matter all that much to women and I was spinning my wheels. That time could've been way better spent working on having more solid game and just becoming more comfortable in my own skin. You are flipping one attraction switch and one only right now (the least signifcant one at that) and that probably has something to do with you being really physically attractive.
A lot of this will just iron itself out. You just need someone to help you identify your real strengths and weaknesses and start working them out.
Sonds to me like your perspectives on what women find atractive about you are either a little off or completely wrong alltogether. You know what you are interested in... LOOKS! So in your eyes you have elevated your game, but you might have only elevated your looks. As far as most women are concerned physical atraction is only part of it and not even the biggest part. You weren't striking out because you were being cocky, you were striking out because you were being cocky to compensate for your insecurity. Women are very intuitive about these things. Take it from me and my own personal struggles with this area. Your mind/personality have not quite caught up to your new body yet. I have at different times worked tirelessly on my "shortcomings" only to find I out some of these things didn't really matter all that much to women and I was spinning my wheels. That time could've been way better spent working on having more solid game and just becoming more comfortable in my own skin. You are flipping one attraction switch and one only right now (the least signifcant one at that) and that probably has something to do with you being really physically attractive.
A lot of this will just iron itself out. You just need someone to help you identify your real strengths and weaknesses and start working them out.
- Guest
by Guest » Wed Apr 07, 2010 11:16 am
[QUOTE=Ram;35663]You are flipping one attraction switch and one only right now (the least signifcant one at that) and that probably has something to do with you being really physically attractive.[/QUOTE]
Being physically attractive is not the least important attraction switch for women. That's just a fallacy.
If you're physically attractive, you have more room for error with your Game. There are so many benefits to being attractive that you'll never fully understand. People do treat you differently if they think you're attractive. I've seen guys roll up into a set and the girls eyes just glitter because she's so attracted to him and you know what? The girl will give him chance after chance. I've seen attractive guys fuck up several times and still be 'forgiven' whereas a less attractive guy doesn't get those opportunities.
Being physically attractive is probably the MOST important attraction switch. The difference between men and women is that it's usually the ONLY attraction switch men put importance on, while women will value other attraction switches.
So, Alpha, you have the important switch. You get treated differently. You're ahead of the game. I honestly believe that your problem is that you're going after women that are not nearly as attractive as you. In which case, you can't have an overbearing personality because the girl is already intimidated by you. Quit playing with the 6s and start Gaming some 9s. Being attractive, cocky, funny, and an asshole (at times) will get you so far with a beautiful woman.
Being physically attractive is not the least important attraction switch for women. That's just a fallacy.
If you're physically attractive, you have more room for error with your Game. There are so many benefits to being attractive that you'll never fully understand. People do treat you differently if they think you're attractive. I've seen guys roll up into a set and the girls eyes just glitter because she's so attracted to him and you know what? The girl will give him chance after chance. I've seen attractive guys fuck up several times and still be 'forgiven' whereas a less attractive guy doesn't get those opportunities.
Being physically attractive is probably the MOST important attraction switch. The difference between men and women is that it's usually the ONLY attraction switch men put importance on, while women will value other attraction switches.
So, Alpha, you have the important switch. You get treated differently. You're ahead of the game. I honestly believe that your problem is that you're going after women that are not nearly as attractive as you. In which case, you can't have an overbearing personality because the girl is already intimidated by you. Quit playing with the 6s and start Gaming some 9s. Being attractive, cocky, funny, and an asshole (at times) will get you so far with a beautiful woman.
- Guest
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