[quote1246552622=Lazarus]
Curious: what rights do you feel we're missing?
[/quote1246552622]
Respect. Men are missing respect.
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by Guest » Thu Jul 02, 2009 11:53 am
Huh? Respect is earned good sirs. It isn't something that is handed over on a silver platter because you think you are entitled to it. I respect people who are hardworking, honest, and contribute to society.
I agree that ADHD is over diagnosed; however to say it is a plot to keep men down is quite laughable. Also alimony is based on the fact of a sustained way of life for the partner in the relationship who makes less than the other partner. Men can also be entitled to this if your partner were to make more money than you.
I agree that ADHD is over diagnosed; however to say it is a plot to keep men down is quite laughable. Also alimony is based on the fact of a sustained way of life for the partner in the relationship who makes less than the other partner. Men can also be entitled to this if your partner were to make more money than you.
- Guest
by Guest » Thu Jul 02, 2009 2:01 pm
Yeah, I'm going to have to agree in that respect is earned.
I'm not even sure if I know what it means to have "the right to be respected."
Everyone should have friends, but does that mean there should be some loner's movement that forces others to befriend them? Or should those with few friends work on themselves?
To me, this sounds like shifting the blame.
Frankly, I find Homer's idiocy hilarious, and the "perception" that people will respect [b]me[/b] less because of him, is just that ... a perception.
As for all the legal issues you mention, or the examples of ADHD - I don't know enough about those topics to really discuss
I'm not even sure if I know what it means to have "the right to be respected."
Everyone should have friends, but does that mean there should be some loner's movement that forces others to befriend them? Or should those with few friends work on themselves?
To me, this sounds like shifting the blame.
Frankly, I find Homer's idiocy hilarious, and the "perception" that people will respect [b]me[/b] less because of him, is just that ... a perception.
As for all the legal issues you mention, or the examples of ADHD - I don't know enough about those topics to really discuss
- Guest
by Guest » Thu Jul 02, 2009 2:41 pm
I think there are two sides that need to be treated very differently. The social side and the legal side.
Society is what it is. There are a lot of what I think are wrong beliefs that are very common, like that women are judged negatively for having sex, or the whole "prince charming" model of relationships that so many girls grow up with. Society is complex and there will always be varying views. Men are expected to be a certain way, and certain things are okay and some are generally not accepted socially. But I don't think it's productive to bitch about it. Set a good example of your views and values. Convince people one at a time.
The legal side is completely different. Women get different treatment in law. They can make false accusations of rape, they get different consideration in custody or child support, divorce, domestic violence, and so forth. These are wrong and need to be fixed. They need to be fixed specifically, not just clumsily trying to tilt the balance the other way -- that would merely lead to injustices on the other side too.
Short people get less respect than tall people. Young people (or young-looking people) get less respect than older people. Is it unfair? Probably. Is it wrong? Maybe, but [i]irrelevant[/i]. Tough shit. Deal with it.
Society is what it is. There are a lot of what I think are wrong beliefs that are very common, like that women are judged negatively for having sex, or the whole "prince charming" model of relationships that so many girls grow up with. Society is complex and there will always be varying views. Men are expected to be a certain way, and certain things are okay and some are generally not accepted socially. But I don't think it's productive to bitch about it. Set a good example of your views and values. Convince people one at a time.
The legal side is completely different. Women get different treatment in law. They can make false accusations of rape, they get different consideration in custody or child support, divorce, domestic violence, and so forth. These are wrong and need to be fixed. They need to be fixed specifically, not just clumsily trying to tilt the balance the other way -- that would merely lead to injustices on the other side too.
Short people get less respect than tall people. Young people (or young-looking people) get less respect than older people. Is it unfair? Probably. Is it wrong? Maybe, but [i]irrelevant[/i]. Tough shit. Deal with it.
- Guest
by Guest » Thu Jul 02, 2009 3:37 pm
Fin, I think men are granted plenty of respect...however, society doesn't feel that this respect is warranted (thus resulting in the feminist movement). Therefore, society has created structures and institutions to try to level the playing field.
As for not having organizations that are male activist in nature...well, we do, the community is definitely one of them. The reason we don't have many of them is because we are the stronger of the two sexes. You see, men fundamentally want to try to be leaders and attain power...women fundamentally wish to conform, be part of a group, and be protected.
Fact is that a man's strength breeds his independence. Just look at the animal kingdom. The alpha male of a pride of lions will routinely be challenged by a lone male searching to take over a pride. This happens in many different species. The reason men don't flock to these groups is because we don't have the group mentality drive AS MUCH as women (sure it's still there, but not as strong).
It's not uncommon for men to be alone in their environment. Look at the bars. If you see a woman by herself it's deemed weird, shit we have a specific name for it (lone wolf). What about the bachelor with no kids that never gets married? He's not nearly as socially awkward as the woman with no kids that never got married. Or how about the way women travel in herds? 2, 3, 4 of them go to the bathroom at the same time. Men? The only time we go to the bathroom together is when we're going to to a line of coke off the bathroom stall.
Remember the Million Man March? What a fucking joke that was. Even as a young, awkward kid I remember thinking to myself that those guys were flat out pussies. Men don't ban together, we compete with each other
These groups don't exist for men because we are not biologically wired to assimilate into them. Instead, we're wired to attempt to rule them. Women on the other hand require strength to be intimidating. Men on the other hand just have to be, in order to be intimidating.
The mere dynamic that women have to seek out groups, while men rule the world on an individual basis should tell you everything about how the world truly does respect, awe, and fear the strength of a man.
Now, I know what you're saying and where you're coming from. In the legal system, men, quite frequently get a raw deal. But, I would contend that this is the price we pay for being the truly stronger of the two sexes. It's society's way of trying to keep our strength and domination in check. It is NOT FAIR. But, being born as a stronger, more dominating figure could be argued as not being fair either.
Is it fair that our government consistently confiscates our wealth and pisses it away or tells us what kind of cars we can drive or tells us the type of light bulb we can use in our own homes? No, it's not fair. As a matter of fact, it's a crime against Nature herself. But, when the government decides to steal more of your money, you have two decisions (outside of political change):
1) You can complain about how unfair it is
2) You can go out in the world and stake an even larger claim
Women usually do the first, men do the second.
Further more, a man will more likely stake a larger claim on his own without banning together in a group. A woman, will seek out others to ban together with so that her internal lack of strength is offset by her strength in numbers.
As for not having organizations that are male activist in nature...well, we do, the community is definitely one of them. The reason we don't have many of them is because we are the stronger of the two sexes. You see, men fundamentally want to try to be leaders and attain power...women fundamentally wish to conform, be part of a group, and be protected.
Fact is that a man's strength breeds his independence. Just look at the animal kingdom. The alpha male of a pride of lions will routinely be challenged by a lone male searching to take over a pride. This happens in many different species. The reason men don't flock to these groups is because we don't have the group mentality drive AS MUCH as women (sure it's still there, but not as strong).
It's not uncommon for men to be alone in their environment. Look at the bars. If you see a woman by herself it's deemed weird, shit we have a specific name for it (lone wolf). What about the bachelor with no kids that never gets married? He's not nearly as socially awkward as the woman with no kids that never got married. Or how about the way women travel in herds? 2, 3, 4 of them go to the bathroom at the same time. Men? The only time we go to the bathroom together is when we're going to to a line of coke off the bathroom stall.
Remember the Million Man March? What a fucking joke that was. Even as a young, awkward kid I remember thinking to myself that those guys were flat out pussies. Men don't ban together, we compete with each other
These groups don't exist for men because we are not biologically wired to assimilate into them. Instead, we're wired to attempt to rule them. Women on the other hand require strength to be intimidating. Men on the other hand just have to be, in order to be intimidating.
The mere dynamic that women have to seek out groups, while men rule the world on an individual basis should tell you everything about how the world truly does respect, awe, and fear the strength of a man.
Now, I know what you're saying and where you're coming from. In the legal system, men, quite frequently get a raw deal. But, I would contend that this is the price we pay for being the truly stronger of the two sexes. It's society's way of trying to keep our strength and domination in check. It is NOT FAIR. But, being born as a stronger, more dominating figure could be argued as not being fair either.
Is it fair that our government consistently confiscates our wealth and pisses it away or tells us what kind of cars we can drive or tells us the type of light bulb we can use in our own homes? No, it's not fair. As a matter of fact, it's a crime against Nature herself. But, when the government decides to steal more of your money, you have two decisions (outside of political change):
1) You can complain about how unfair it is
2) You can go out in the world and stake an even larger claim
Women usually do the first, men do the second.
Further more, a man will more likely stake a larger claim on his own without banning together in a group. A woman, will seek out others to ban together with so that her internal lack of strength is offset by her strength in numbers.
- Guest
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