Something has been rattling around my head lately and I'm curious if you guys feel the same.
This primarily goes out to more seasoned guys, but all are welcome to chime in.
I used to revere women. I held them in such high esteem. To me, they were something to be cherished. And, when you got one of quality, you treated her as such. I was always so taken aback by them. Being with one, was the single greatest drug or high I could have ever had. The feeling was unique to any I've ever felt. And, I cherished that feeling...I reveled in it.
But, we all make choices...
A few years ago, I made a choice. My choice was to become part of our community. If you're reading this, then you and I are in the same in that respect.
At the time, I made my decision because I wanted to get 'better' women. You can define 'better' however you see fit. I felt I could get higher quality women, and that became my goal. A secondary goal was to make friends with other like-minded guys along the way. I feel as if I have accomplished both goals. But, lately I've been thinking about what the cost of this 'success' has been.
It's funny, but in many ways I think of my choice as the 'red pill - blue pill' decision. As in The Matrix, we can either take the red pill or the blue pill. One will change nothing, we'll continue living our lives and that's that. The other, will 'wake us up.'
I see things differently now. Where, before, I would have been blind to eye contact, an IOI, or IOD...now, I read them in my interactions and in other people's interactions much like the code that ran The Matrix. I'm no longer ignorant to social interaction, no longer oblivious.
For me, the price of my newly found social skills is the loss of that reverence for women. For the most part, I simply consider women to be a colossal pain in the ass. I'm not sure if I feel this way because:
-I understand their nature better (which is almost 180 degrees different from how I used to view them)
-I know I have options (an abundance mentality)
-I have more respect for myself, so I'm not willing to just 'take your shit' because I know I deserve more
-I've become too alpha, and am unwilling to compromise on anything or just deal with undesirable situations or whatever
-I have become a misogynist, and view women as beneath me
-They're novelty has worn off, in other words I've had enough women to understand that they are not rare by any means
Now, I do have an LTR. And, she is by far the 'best' girl I've ever been with. But, I still don't get the same thrill from her that I used to get from say my pre-community crappiest girl-friend.
So, my question is do you guys feel as if you've lost something as you've found yourself? Do we all morph into something similar to this? If so, is it just a defense mechanism to prevent us from really getting close to any one? Are we exacting our revenge in a passive-aggressive sort of way? Is the ignorant AFC with few options inherently happier than an enlightened PUA with many options? Is it true...ignorance is bliss?
Dallas PUA
The Pickup Artist Playground
The Community Matrix
21 posts
• Page 1 of 3 • 1, 2, 3
by Guest » Fri May 29, 2009 11:18 am
[quote1243613795=Bull Run]
Is the ignorant AFC with few options inherently happier than an enlightened PUA with many options?
[/quote1243613795]
I posed this exact question to myself about 6 months ago on my site.
And in my head the answer is Yes. As long as said AFC can at least get a girl then Yes.
At least in my eyes since I am a picky bastard and worried I will never find a suitable girl.
Is the ignorant AFC with few options inherently happier than an enlightened PUA with many options?
[/quote1243613795]
I posed this exact question to myself about 6 months ago on my site.
And in my head the answer is Yes. As long as said AFC can at least get a girl then Yes.
At least in my eyes since I am a picky bastard and worried I will never find a suitable girl.
- Guest
by Guest » Fri May 29, 2009 4:01 pm
I believe there is still a nagging difference between early 19th century aristocrat and 20th century men.
Fathers are supposed to teach use the things that the red or blue pill woke us up too. Our fathers have not taught us this correlation between "societal views" and our goals/life.
Whereas once reserved for only the wealthiest and more prominent members of society, we are now able to rival them in regards to knowledge about how society works just be use of our own "community".
Much like the colonization of the America's where the Indians didn't understand the white mans use of chattel and where the white man didn't understand the Indians use for wampum or desire to not have material possessions or few rather.
Survival of the fittest.
I don't believe that ignorance is always bliss, and in this case I believe that if you view it as such, this information can be used to your advantage.
If the world wasn't as capitalistic as it is, and if society were different I would probably still think the same, it just wouldn't matter as much.
As far as women AND this information are concerned. They are worthless to me now. (unless they prove worth some other way). Society holds men accountable, and gives away our rights. If a man, and a woman were pitted against each other, with society judging the winner, the woman has a higher chance of gaining favor over the man, and the man is expected to "suck it up".
Why put yourself in that situation?
What we are learning here transcends male/female interaction it reverberates through our entire society, the problems facing "gentlemen" today.
It is an awakening and helps me not get tangled in the mess that is society. In the world, not of it. Living my life outside the box.
We are not the only ones to use this method of "awakening". The settlers did it when colonizing the Americas all in the name of Religion, and Economic freedoms. We are gaining a sort of freedom from society.
As far as LTRs go, as long as she understands that both of you help each other and that both of you have needs, there shouldn't be an issue. If a girl doesn't give me sex, she can expect I'll go elsewhere, likewise with her. You are supposed to compliment each other. Expectations are the key. The less you have, the less you'll have to argue about, at least with that, the most you'll have to deal with are her insecurities about you being able to just go off and find someone else.
No ignorance is not bliss to me. Ignorance in today's society is weakness.
Fathers are supposed to teach use the things that the red or blue pill woke us up too. Our fathers have not taught us this correlation between "societal views" and our goals/life.
Whereas once reserved for only the wealthiest and more prominent members of society, we are now able to rival them in regards to knowledge about how society works just be use of our own "community".
Much like the colonization of the America's where the Indians didn't understand the white mans use of chattel and where the white man didn't understand the Indians use for wampum or desire to not have material possessions or few rather.
Survival of the fittest.
I don't believe that ignorance is always bliss, and in this case I believe that if you view it as such, this information can be used to your advantage.
If the world wasn't as capitalistic as it is, and if society were different I would probably still think the same, it just wouldn't matter as much.
As far as women AND this information are concerned. They are worthless to me now. (unless they prove worth some other way). Society holds men accountable, and gives away our rights. If a man, and a woman were pitted against each other, with society judging the winner, the woman has a higher chance of gaining favor over the man, and the man is expected to "suck it up".
Why put yourself in that situation?
What we are learning here transcends male/female interaction it reverberates through our entire society, the problems facing "gentlemen" today.
It is an awakening and helps me not get tangled in the mess that is society. In the world, not of it. Living my life outside the box.
We are not the only ones to use this method of "awakening". The settlers did it when colonizing the Americas all in the name of Religion, and Economic freedoms. We are gaining a sort of freedom from society.
As far as LTRs go, as long as she understands that both of you help each other and that both of you have needs, there shouldn't be an issue. If a girl doesn't give me sex, she can expect I'll go elsewhere, likewise with her. You are supposed to compliment each other. Expectations are the key. The less you have, the less you'll have to argue about, at least with that, the most you'll have to deal with are her insecurities about you being able to just go off and find someone else.
No ignorance is not bliss to me. Ignorance in today's society is weakness.
- Guest
by Guest » Fri May 29, 2009 5:52 pm
Except for in situations as my parents (and most other poor people) where they feel they are always "kicked while they are down".
The problem is, they are in turmoil AND are too lazy to do something about it. Yes, I called my parents lazy.
Not lazy in the sense that they work hard, just lazy in the sense that they do not care to understand society. A society in which does, "kick" the weak.
God Bless America!
The problem is, they are in turmoil AND are too lazy to do something about it. Yes, I called my parents lazy.
Not lazy in the sense that they work hard, just lazy in the sense that they do not care to understand society. A society in which does, "kick" the weak.
God Bless America!
- Guest
by Guest » Fri May 29, 2009 7:09 pm
[quote1243641431=Finesse]
As far as LTRs go, as long as she understands that both of you help each other and that both of you have needs, there shouldn't be an issue. If a girl doesn't give me sex, she can expect I'll go elsewhere, likewise with her. You are supposed to compliment each other. Expectations are the key. The less you have, the less you'll have to argue about, at least with that, the most you'll have to deal with are her insecurities about you being able to just go off and find someone else.
[/quote1243641431]
From your reply, i think you are reading BRs post much more literal than at least I was taking it. It's not even so much (in my opinion) that we need to each do such-and-such and everything is ok, it was more conceptual
In my mind, i almost wish i could go back to a oneitis mind-set sometimes. The mindset that a woman is a scarce resource, i put up w/ BS, because i'm afraid of losing what i have, i put her on a pedastal, but at the end of the day i'm madly in love w her.
Of course, this is said after taking the other pill and not being ignorant to what can be with the proper training.
I question my ability to fall madly in love without having to extend that "all or nothing" mindset to a relationship and the ability to unlock that..... after discovering the community and reaching a certain level.
As far as LTRs go, as long as she understands that both of you help each other and that both of you have needs, there shouldn't be an issue. If a girl doesn't give me sex, she can expect I'll go elsewhere, likewise with her. You are supposed to compliment each other. Expectations are the key. The less you have, the less you'll have to argue about, at least with that, the most you'll have to deal with are her insecurities about you being able to just go off and find someone else.
[/quote1243641431]
From your reply, i think you are reading BRs post much more literal than at least I was taking it. It's not even so much (in my opinion) that we need to each do such-and-such and everything is ok, it was more conceptual
In my mind, i almost wish i could go back to a oneitis mind-set sometimes. The mindset that a woman is a scarce resource, i put up w/ BS, because i'm afraid of losing what i have, i put her on a pedastal, but at the end of the day i'm madly in love w her.
Of course, this is said after taking the other pill and not being ignorant to what can be with the proper training.
I question my ability to fall madly in love without having to extend that "all or nothing" mindset to a relationship and the ability to unlock that..... after discovering the community and reaching a certain level.
- Guest
by Guest » Sat May 30, 2009 8:33 am
Interesting there are several of us in the exact same boat here. I"m actually surprised.
I've often reflected on how I got to the point where women just weren't "all that" to me any longer. For me, it isn't just "one" thing:
-When I first started this PUA thing, I dove in deep and learned everything I could as fast as I could. It was something new, exciting, and challenging. Over time I got better and better and started getting women of higher value(looks, brains, wealth). Eventually I reached my goals and was satisfied with my results. I had went through a bunch of women to get my education, but eventually achieved success. Its kind of a "I came, I saw, I conquered"...........been there done that.........now what? I've done what I set out to do, and now its no longer a great challenge to me, I have lost interest in chasing women. Perhaps having relationships with a multitude of women in the past 1.5yrs has desensitized me??? haha maybe I need psychological help.
-Sometimes I wonder if my sex drive dropping off has someting to do with this phenomenon. I imagine it has a lot to do with how you view women in the first place. A drop in testosterone level has something to do with it. I've gone through the try all the sex positions, have lots of hot kinky sex stage.........yeah no big deal anymore. My dick doesn't get as hard as it used to and I just don't get that excited about sex like I did in my 20's when I couldn't get enough.
-Something else to think about is the whole alpha vs. beta thing. Alpha personalities don't "need" a woman to complete themselves. Everyone knows that the alpha personality is more successful than the beta personality when it comes to women so we all try hard to become alpha in our lives. Its almost like you eventually go overboard. As with most things in life, some where in the middle isn't a bad place to be. Its good to be "balanced" in all facets of life.
-Face it, life changes. Things that were important a few years ago might not be important to you today. Its how the aging process works. Its about evolving to the next stage of life. And with age, we tend to become less tolerant of bs.
-After I've learned what women are really about, I just don't see what they have to offer me. I appreciate my time with a quality woman and am respectful. But if I want to have fun I hang out with my buddies and do guy shit, or I go play with my racecar.
-Going through my divorce definitely made me more self-sufficient. I depend on no one but myself now days......and I prefer it that way. I've got a nice house, cars, toys, my bills get paid on time, clean my own house, cook my own meals, wash my own clothes........what the hell do I need a woman for? My dog & friends offer companionship with out all the drama a woman brings.
Its crazy to think, but back in highschool when I first started dating my exwife I thought she was the greatest thing ever. Nowdays I realize she was and is as fucked up as the rest of those hookers out there. I have gone through 20 different girls and haven't found one that is even close to "great" or that I would think about marrying. I think its because I know more about the female mind, and as a result it keeps me from falling head over heals. Also the more I experience, the more I discover what it is I want in a woman. As a result my expectations/needs/wants/desires become higher. In reality, the perfect woman doesn't exist. Its just an idea in my head and on the pages of Playboy! ;-)
I'm definitely glad that I did the whole "married" thing before experiencing "pick up". I don't think I would have married if it was the other way around. I am fortunate to be able to experience both. Learned a lot about myself and women in doing so.
These days it comes down to :
"Come, stay, lay, or pray".........I really don't care what they do.
10-4
That's how i'm rollin.
I've often reflected on how I got to the point where women just weren't "all that" to me any longer. For me, it isn't just "one" thing:
-When I first started this PUA thing, I dove in deep and learned everything I could as fast as I could. It was something new, exciting, and challenging. Over time I got better and better and started getting women of higher value(looks, brains, wealth). Eventually I reached my goals and was satisfied with my results. I had went through a bunch of women to get my education, but eventually achieved success. Its kind of a "I came, I saw, I conquered"...........been there done that.........now what? I've done what I set out to do, and now its no longer a great challenge to me, I have lost interest in chasing women. Perhaps having relationships with a multitude of women in the past 1.5yrs has desensitized me??? haha maybe I need psychological help.
-Sometimes I wonder if my sex drive dropping off has someting to do with this phenomenon. I imagine it has a lot to do with how you view women in the first place. A drop in testosterone level has something to do with it. I've gone through the try all the sex positions, have lots of hot kinky sex stage.........yeah no big deal anymore. My dick doesn't get as hard as it used to and I just don't get that excited about sex like I did in my 20's when I couldn't get enough.
-Something else to think about is the whole alpha vs. beta thing. Alpha personalities don't "need" a woman to complete themselves. Everyone knows that the alpha personality is more successful than the beta personality when it comes to women so we all try hard to become alpha in our lives. Its almost like you eventually go overboard. As with most things in life, some where in the middle isn't a bad place to be. Its good to be "balanced" in all facets of life.
-Face it, life changes. Things that were important a few years ago might not be important to you today. Its how the aging process works. Its about evolving to the next stage of life. And with age, we tend to become less tolerant of bs.
-After I've learned what women are really about, I just don't see what they have to offer me. I appreciate my time with a quality woman and am respectful. But if I want to have fun I hang out with my buddies and do guy shit, or I go play with my racecar.
-Going through my divorce definitely made me more self-sufficient. I depend on no one but myself now days......and I prefer it that way. I've got a nice house, cars, toys, my bills get paid on time, clean my own house, cook my own meals, wash my own clothes........what the hell do I need a woman for? My dog & friends offer companionship with out all the drama a woman brings.
Its crazy to think, but back in highschool when I first started dating my exwife I thought she was the greatest thing ever. Nowdays I realize she was and is as fucked up as the rest of those hookers out there. I have gone through 20 different girls and haven't found one that is even close to "great" or that I would think about marrying. I think its because I know more about the female mind, and as a result it keeps me from falling head over heals. Also the more I experience, the more I discover what it is I want in a woman. As a result my expectations/needs/wants/desires become higher. In reality, the perfect woman doesn't exist. Its just an idea in my head and on the pages of Playboy! ;-)
I'm definitely glad that I did the whole "married" thing before experiencing "pick up". I don't think I would have married if it was the other way around. I am fortunate to be able to experience both. Learned a lot about myself and women in doing so.
These days it comes down to :
"Come, stay, lay, or pray".........I really don't care what they do.
10-4
That's how i'm rollin.
- Guest
by Guest » Sat May 30, 2009 2:07 pm
[blockquote]In my mind, i almost wish i could go back to a oneitis mind-set sometimes. The mindset that a woman is a scarce resource, i put up w/ BS, because i'm afraid of losing what i have, i put her on a pedastal, but at the end of the day i'm madly in love w her.
[/blockquote]
I saw this in my own marriage to some extent and see it in several of my buddies marriages. There is a self-destructive side to this way of behaving. Over time those girls who love being placed on a pedestal learn to expect it. It becomes "too" much of a good thing. After a while, they need more and more to keep feeling special. They want a higher pedestal to sit their pretty little ass cheeks on. What girl doesn't want a guy wrapped around her finger. Before you know it, they slowly lose respect for you and you end up working for them. The whole relationship becomes about them! In reality you are doing way too much for them. Then someday you look up and say "fuck that nagging non-appreciative self centered bitch".
Also, for me at the root of this phenomenon, I am a person who wants what I can't have. When I am dating a few random girls, I want a serious one. Then when I have a serious one, I just want to hang with my boys and date random girls.
I would also venture to say that the typical mindset of a PUA wants the best and has higher expectations than the average guy. These personalities are rarely 100pct satisfied with the status quo which is most likely the inherent problem. People who want the best and figure out how to get it rarely are ever satisfied. They thrive off challenging themselves. Its like an inner hunger that you can't satisfy.
[/blockquote]
I saw this in my own marriage to some extent and see it in several of my buddies marriages. There is a self-destructive side to this way of behaving. Over time those girls who love being placed on a pedestal learn to expect it. It becomes "too" much of a good thing. After a while, they need more and more to keep feeling special. They want a higher pedestal to sit their pretty little ass cheeks on. What girl doesn't want a guy wrapped around her finger. Before you know it, they slowly lose respect for you and you end up working for them. The whole relationship becomes about them! In reality you are doing way too much for them. Then someday you look up and say "fuck that nagging non-appreciative self centered bitch".
Also, for me at the root of this phenomenon, I am a person who wants what I can't have. When I am dating a few random girls, I want a serious one. Then when I have a serious one, I just want to hang with my boys and date random girls.
I would also venture to say that the typical mindset of a PUA wants the best and has higher expectations than the average guy. These personalities are rarely 100pct satisfied with the status quo which is most likely the inherent problem. People who want the best and figure out how to get it rarely are ever satisfied. They thrive off challenging themselves. Its like an inner hunger that you can't satisfy.
- Guest
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