Online girls

[Guest]

I have no problem attracting/conversing & providing entertaining banter with decent girls off match.com but sometimes I am left feeling like I am the one that constantly has to "pimp" the conversation. Its like they love the attention and feelings I bring out of them but they do little on their part to convince me why I should take them out.

I've gotten pretty selective on who I choose to take out off the internet so a chic really has to impress me. lol, it wasn't always that way. In the past if she was hot and had a pulse I was taking her out and didn't worry about how interested she was.

Nowdays I'm tired of feeling like a free meal/drink/entertaiment ticket.

These girls have the upper hand and they know it. You can see it in how little effort they put into their profiles.

So what are some "tricks of the trade" that my fellow pimps use to get girls to invest?

Or do I just suck it up, quit bitchin, and stand on the gas and say who the fuck cares?

Its like I've almost learned too much about women and I know all the warning signs and what their bullshit antics mean so I play it safe and not waste my time on girls unless I've got a sure deal. But I also know the ones worth having don't come easy.

The top girls are getting hammered with messages so that instantly puts them on the defensive side of the game so they don't worry about their offensive game. Maybe this is just what we are up against.

[Guest]

[QUOTE=UncleHOwie;38778]I have no problem attracting/conversing & providing entertaining banter with decent girls off match.com but sometimes I am left feeling like I am the one that constantly has to "pimp" the conversation. Its like they love the attention and feelings I bring out of them but they do little on their part to convince me why I should take them out.

I've gotten pretty selective on who I choose to take out off the internet so a chic really has to impress me. lol, it wasn't always that way. In the past if she was hot and had a pulse I was taking her out and didn't worry about how interested she was.

Nowdays I'm tired of feeling like a free meal/drink/entertaiment ticket.

These girls have the upper hand and they know it. You can see it in how little effort they put into their profiles.

So what are some "tricks of the trade" that my fellow pimps use to get girls to invest?

Or do I just suck it up, quit bitchin, and stand on the gas and say who the fuck cares?

Its like I've almost learned too much about women and I know all the warning signs and what their bullshit antics mean so I play it safe and not waste my time on girls unless I've got a sure deal. But I also know the ones worth having don't come easy.

The top girls are getting hammered with messages so that instantly puts them on the defensive side of the game so they don't worry about their offensive game. Maybe this is just what we are up against.[/QUOTE]

The girls have the upper hand because you willingly give them the upper hand. Why on earth would you take out a girl, whom you don't know, and pay for her meal, drinks, and entertainment? Doing that sets up a beta-provider frame.

I go on about a date a weak from match. I have the upper hand and the girls know it. I have the upper hand because I don't give out much information about myself, I don't pay for their stuff, and I sure as hell don't take them out for a night on the town on my dime. 85% of the time I go to a starbucks 4 minutes away from my apt. If I like the girl, if we connect, then I can take her to a bar down the street or to my apt. If I don't like her I am out $2 and 30 minutes to an hour.

There is no possible way to know if you like a girl until you meet her. Her e-mails may dazzle you but when you go to meet her she talks out of the side of her mouth like Rocky. Other than being attractive, how could a girl impress you enough to go out with her? You should know by now not to believe their words but to believe their actions. I don't even bother reading profiles until the date is set, and I average about 3 or 4 messages to set up the date. I don't want to waste my time with a pen-pal. My objective is to get the girls out on my terms. Unless they say something highly offensive to me there isn't any point in judging a girl solely by her e-mails.

Here is how you stand out in the online dating world: Don't be like everyone else. Every other guy will send a ton of back and forth e-mails, every other guy will gladly take them out and pay for their shit, every other guy will complain about how hard it is to pick up women online. The truth is that it's the easiest thing in the world. I have never, not once, met up with a girl from match, liked her, and not at the very least made out with her. Usually more. A lot more.

As for the girls that aren't up to your standards, that you don't care for, that rubbed you the wrong way with the way they acted - who cares! Their are plenty more. Don't dwell on the bad. Focus on the good.

I set up my dates with extremely low pressure, make it clear that it's just coffee and conversation, I'm never pushy about it, I make it easy for her. 90% of the time it works all the time.

[B]Forget all the bullshit filler and just get down to business.[/B] [B]Be a man. Tell them what you want in as few words as possible. Make it happen. Don't give in to her silly demands or tests. Do everything on your terms only.

[/B]Good luck!

[Guest]

Lion,

I asked BR for help with my online profile a few days ago. He helped me out a great deal. He mentioned you would be a good resource too so maybe you can break down a little bit about how your emails or interactions on match are structured.

Can you tell us what you tell them you want? How you set the frame? How do you structure you emails? Is there a repeating pattern that you use or is it instinctual? Examples would be awesome. I'm a very analytical person and I often need examples to see exactly how something works.

[Guest]

Lion-

These girls have the upper hand before we even contact them. A hot girl gets 15-30 messages a day giving her the feeling like she has the upper hand and can name her price. I know better than to give the upper hand to any chic.

I'm not interested in going out on random internet dates once a week with random girls. The majority of them are a waste of time. I want them showing some serious interest and investing in ME before I decide to let them in on my life or give them any of my time. The only kind of girl to have is one that thinks you are the "shit" from the start. Not looking for some half ass relationship with a girl that is just hot and fun. Had plenty of that. Those are everywhere and easy to acquire. I also don't live 4 minutes away from anything! So for me to meet a chic some where is at least a 30minute drive. Time is a luxury in my life.

I'd just like to figure out some tactics to screen out the bullshit girls from the start. And yes its 3-4 emails and thats all I have time for as well. I've had a few just want to be text buddies too although they say "I'd LOVE to go on a date with you". I'm not here to entertain these bitches and play their games. There is so much of that to sort thru online.

In real life you can watch her body language and gage how interested a chic is. On the internet, you can't. Girls will tell you all sorts of bullshit. Its just like you said actions speak louder than words.

Half of these girls in their 20's aren't even confident enough to talk on the phone! They'd rather text.......its easier and takes less investment on their part. Its easier to bullshit your way thru something by texting than it is conversing via an actual telephone conversation.

sorry for all the bitching, I just want to figure out a way to cut thru some of the crap.

[Guest]

Here is my online philosophy in a nutshell:

My profile exists to generate attraction and interest. My messages exist to establish a meeting time and place. So if I message a girl and she replies then I automatically assume she is interested and attracted to me. Therefore, I don't worry about generating attraction or interest in my messages. My messages are short, pleasant, low key, upbeat, lower case - they are not [I]try hard[/I] or [I]pick-up artisty[/I]. They are quite the opposite.

Nowadays my messages are never planned in advance. I used to send the same PUA'esque opener to all the girls, but that created too many messages back and forth. I want them out for a coffee and I want to do that in the shortest amount of time possible. Often I say some form of "hi" in the first message and I send out the invite in the second message. When they accept the invite I give them 2 times to choose from, usually monday at 8 or thursday at 8.

As for openers, I just say whatever I want. Even if it's just "hello there". I think about what I might say in person and use that. I wouldn't introduce myself with a paragraph, I would say "hi" and a quick something else.

I rely on a girl being interested in me from my profile. I make sure I have some great, fun pics and I make sure my profile is interesting. Up until a couple weeks ago my 'about me' section was a poem I found. I had almost zero information about myself and it worked like a charm. The poem was one I knew would draw an emotional reaction from the girls. I got many compliments and openers on it. I never said I wrote it, I never said I didn't write it, I simply placed it as my 'about me'. In case you wanted to read it, here it is:

ABOUT ME:
It doesn't interest me what you do for a living. I want to know what you ache for and if you dare to dream of meeting your heart's longing.

It doesn't interest me how old you are. I want to know if you will risk looking like a fool for love, for your dream, for the adventure of being alive.

It doesn't interest me what planets are squaring your moon. I want to know if you have touched the center of your own sorrow, if you have been opened by life's betrayals or have become shrivelled and closed from fear of further pain.

I want to know if you can sit with pain, mine or your own, without moving to hide it, or fade it, or fix it.

I want to know if you can be with joy, mine or your own; if you can dance with wildness and let the ecstasy fill you to the tips of your fingers and toes without cautioning us to be careful, be realistic, remember the limitations of being human.

It doesn't interest me if the story you are telling me is true. I want to know if you can disappoint another to be true to yourself. If you can bear the accusation of betrayal and not betray your own soul. If you can be faithless and therefore trustworthy.

I want to know if you can see Beauty even when it is not pretty every day. And if you can source your own life from its presence.

I want to know if you can live with failure, yours and mine, and still stand at the edge of the lake and shout to the silver of the full moon, 'Yes.'

It doesn't interest me to know where you live or how much money you have. I want to know if you can get up after the night of grief and despair, weary and bruised to the bone and do what needs to be done to feed the children.

It doesn't interest me who you know or how you came to be here. I want to know if you will stand in the center of the fire with me and not shrink back.

It doesn't interest me where or what or with whom you have studied. I want to know what sustains you from the inside when all else falls away.

I want to know if you can be alone with yourself and if you truly like the company you keep in the empty moments.

[Guest]

UncleHowie,

You have all the power in the entire world until you choose to give it away. Make the choice to keep your power and you have the upper hand.


[QUOTE=UncleHOwie;38782]Lion-

These girls have the upper hand before we even contact them. A hot girl gets 15-30 messages a day giving her the feeling like she has the upper hand and can name her price. I know better than to give the upper hand to any chic. [/QUOTE]

You are projecting. You believe she has the upper hand over, therefore she does. Maybe the girl feels like she can't find a good date because all the guys put her on a pedestal. She wants to give her power away to a man. Will you take it?

[QUOTE=UncleHOwie;38782]
I'm not interested in going out on random internet dates once a week with random girls. The majority of them are a waste of time. [B]I want them showing some serious interest and investing in ME[/B] before I decide to let them in on my life or give them any of my time. The only kind of girl to have is one that thinks you are the "shit" from the start. Not looking for some half ass relationship with a girl that is just hot and fun. Had plenty of that. Those are everywhere and easy to acquire. I also don't live 4 minutes away from anything! So for me to meet a chic some where is at least a 30minute drive. Time is a luxury in my life. [/QUOTE]

Ok. You are putting a tremendous amount of pressure on girls you have never met before. Ask yourself this question: "Why should this girl put in some serious interest and investment in a random internet guy she has never seen?"

Are you prepared to put in some serious interest and investment into a random online girl? If you are then shame on you. You're just throwing your power away.

[QUOTE=UncleHOwie;38782]I'd just like to figure out some tactics to screen out the bullshit girls from the start. And yes its 3-4 emails and thats all I have time for as well. I've had a few just want to be text buddies too although they say "I'd LOVE to go on a date with you". [B]I'm not here to entertain these bitches and play their games.[/B] There is so much of that to sort thru online. [/QUOTE]

Isn't that exactly what you're doing and the reason you made the thread?

[QUOTE=UncleHOwie;38782]In real life you can watch her body language and gage how interested a chic is. On the internet, you can't. Girls will tell you all sorts of bullshit. Its just like you said actions speak louder than words. [/QUOTE]

You have just made my point for me. You need to MEET the girls you are interested in. That, and only that, is how you determine her interest. Maybe she plays coy online but in person she is totally into because now you aren't just a computer screen but a real life man.

[QUOTE=UncleHOwie;38782]Half of these girls in their 20's aren't even confident enough to talk on the phone! They'd rather text.......its easier and takes less investment on their part. Its easier to bullshit your way thru something by texting than it is conversing via an actual telephone conversation. [/QUOTE]

You're half right about that. You should only be calling to set up the date and to shoot the shit for a couple minutes. If you're calling to have a serious conversation you're wasting your time. Why would a girl want to do that with someone she hasn't met?

[QUOTE=UncleHOwie;38782]sorry for all the bitching, I just want to figure out a way to cut thru some of the crap.[/QUOTE]

Success requires you change your attitude. Currently you care too much. I hope that helps.

Good luck.