The Bull's Online Study

[Bull Run]

In a previous post, I metioned that I plan to initiate a comprehensive study on online game from the perspective of that which we intend to target: a hottie.

I have created 6 different profiles based on profiles that I have found on the Internet of women from across the country. My intention is to create a wide spectrum of different, stereotypical women that one finds off the Internet. All but one of the profiles will be women that I find to be attractive. One of the profiles will be of a pretty in the face, but fat girl. I decided to include the fattie in the mix because I suspect that men will still approach her in large numbers.

The rest of the women will encompass different types:

The LONG profile writer
The smart girl
The clever girl
The short profile writer
The cool / alternative girl (I'm especially interested in this one)

All of the women will be without children and in their mid-20's. All, save for the fattie, will be a 7.5+. NONE will be a 10.

In addition, I will be responding to various emails from men posing as the woman. I will take these emails to there ultimate end in which he asks for or provides an outside contact information. Then, I'll cut him off and move on. I know how coy women can be on the Net so I'm going to play that routine. I'll throw out shit tests and generally be aloof. Nothing too direct. I want to see how these guys can succeed if they work for it.

For the men that are able to sufficiently pass the shit tests, I will review their profile and mine it looking for attitude, tone, and other things that make his profile good and him different. The idea is that his profile should reflect his ability to pass my shit tests.

In addition, the responses I get should be gold. I bet we get some great information out of that alone.

The data I will track are going to be hits, emails, winks, and subject lines (the goal is to find out what percent of guys just send Hi, Hello, etc). Further, I will be looking for clever openers that can be used or modified for future use.

Stay tuned as I post my progress and what I've learned.

[Guest]

I can just see myself messaging one of your chicks and wondering wth went wrong. Looks like an interesting experiment keep me updated.

[Guest]

[LEFT]Day 1: Clever Girl Profile[/LEFT]

[LEFT]The girl in this profile is a solid 8. She's a red head and I've implied that she's not from the U.S. originally. She's educated, has a good job, and the profile is one of the better word play ones I've run across.[/LEFT]

[LEFT]I posted the profile Tuesday October 12 at approximately 10am. It is now Wednesday October 13 at approximately 3:45pm.[/LEFT]

[LEFT]Hits: 244 (only 169 unique viewers indicating that these guys look at the profile over and over...kind of creepy)
Emails Received: 33
Winks Received: 64
Times Favorited: 8
Men Interested: 22 (these are outside of winks/emails)
IM Requests: ~15[/LEFT]

[LEFT]Notes:[/LEFT]

[LEFT]Updated the profile this morning to keep it fresh in the searches. The feeding frenzy seems to have slowed substantially. The profile has garnered much less interest today than it did yesterday. I'd say traffic is 25% of what it was yesterday.[/LEFT]

[LEFT]The profile has received only two emails from guys that I thought had a somewhat clever opener/profile. I have responded to two emails. One was a very strong Alpha male, the other was more of a high status Beta using clever lines and humor to build rapport/create attraction. Both sent me their emails so I could look them up on Facebook, seems odd to pull a girl from the Internet over to a different place on the Internet.[/LEFT]

[LEFT]About 60% of the emails have Hi, hey, hello, or something similar in the subject line. 20-25% of the subject lines have no subject. 10% are a compliment on her beauty or a request for a date. Only 2 had something totally unique that stood out from the crowd.[/LEFT]

[LEFT]Initial thoughts: Men pounce and FAST. They're actively searching and they hit hard and fast. Many mark the girl as a favorite or interest, then wink, and then send an email. Seems like over kill to me. It must be incredibly intimidating to women to have so much response so soon. Ego booster as well. Even I found myself getting irritated and much more picky, which seems odd because I'm not gay.[/LEFT]

[LEFT]Most men don't even read the profile. They just look at the pics and then shoot off an email. It's obvious this is the case. Blatantly in fact. There are a lot of guys in the 40+ crowd trying to pull a mid-20s hottie off the Net because they have no other place to do so.[/LEFT]

[LEFT]The profiles of the men that I've read all suck. Many are self-depricating, many are too wordy, many are too serious/personal. A lot of them read like resumes and the tone of each profile is generally one of extreme Betaness. In addition, I've found that most guys put a variety of female body types that are acceptable to them (Curvy, Few Extra Lbs, About Average, Slender, Athletic)...I included a fattie to test the theory that men make themselves seem open-minded here in an effort to not scare off women. Further, apparently every man in the DFW is Athletic and Toned...one fat bastard put that on his and then I saw a picture of his fat ass without his shirt on...20% body fat if I ever saw it. Small guys think they're athletic and toned, fat guys think the same, and guys that are just average do as well. I find that to be the funniest finding so far. And, most of these guys DISQUALIFY themselves. Seriously, that's HER job, not make it easy for them.[/LEFT]

[LEFT]The profile is still running so I'll keep you updated. But, I have a feeling it's gotten 80% of the mileage it's going to get. 80% over the course of 30 hours...that's a telling stat if it bears out to be true.[/LEFT]

[Guest]

I hope you follow up on this because it seems like it will be some awesome information.

I have to ask though. How can you put yourself in the girls shoes and only answer the ones you think are acceptable? Shouldn't you answer all of them to see how a beta/alpha interact to a response from the girl?

I haven't thought much about online dating but if I was to go on there and make a profile and message girls here is what I would put in the subject line: I would put something in Latin. I think it would pique the girls interest and make her inclined to at least open it.

Can you, Bull Run, give that a try and see if your responses go up the next time you send out a message to some females from your normal account.

[Guest]

[QUOTE=playercool;38067]I hope you follow up on this because it seems like it will be some awesome information.

I have to ask though. How can you put yourself in the girls shoes and only answer the ones you think are acceptable? Shouldn't you answer all of them to see how a beta/alpha interact to a response from the girl?

I haven't thought much about online dating but if I was to go on there and make a profile and message girls here is what I would put in the subject line: I would put something in Latin. I think it would pique the girls interest and make her inclined to at least open it.

Can you, Bull Run, give that a try and see if your responses go up the next time you send out a message to some females from your normal account.[/QUOTE]


This is a great reco...I will give the Latin subject line a shot.

As for whether or not I should respond to every email, I simply don't have the time. If 85% of the emails have the subject line of 'Hi' or some variation, then I shouldn't waste time on responding. The goal is to seek out the unique guys and see what makes them tick...everyone knows how a guy that says: "Hi. I loved your pictures and your profile was great too!! How's your day been?" will be responded to by a beautiful woman.

It has been acknowledged that being different in the opener promotes a HUGE amount of success...

Once I start running my profile for real, I'll use the Latin subject line to see how effective it is...

[Guest]

Deus ex machina.

[Guest]

[LEFT]It's been slightly over 48 hours, 50 to be percise and here are the stats:[/LEFT]

[LEFT]Hits: 407 (only 268 unique viewers indicating that these guys look at the profile over and over...kind of creepy)
Emails Received: 49
Winks Received: 93
Times Favorited: 10
Men Interested: 36 (these are outside of winks/emails)
IM Requests: ~ 15[/LEFT]

The responses are definitely losing steam now. But, the emails are still basically the same: "Hi, I saw your profile and you seemed interesting. Blah, blah, blah." 95% of all emails have been essentially the same, only 2 where somewhat unique.

A few guys asked for a date or forwarded their number in the opening email...pathetic.

There are way too many winks. Sure, some of these guys eventually email but come on guys put forth some effort. Seriously.

The profiles all seem to be the same. Either super Alpha (only 1 or 2) or super BETA.

I'm beginning to theorize that women still do not view online dating as an acceptable way of meeting someone...some do, but I suspect the high value women do not. However, men do view it as socially acceptable and probably think of it as a great idea because they don't have to approach and risk being rejected.

So, when a girl gives in and signs up online and then gets innudated withing literally minutes of posting their profile, they feel validated because they're beautiful but they also rationalize why not to take it seriously because of the incredible response rate.

The noise, or responses, got me thinking. Think of it like this: if you're in a group of men and you all approach one girl at exactly the same time then how is she going to react? In person, she'll most likely pick the tallest, most attractive, most fit guy because that's all she has to go on and all she can process. In that case, Game really has no place (besides peacocking and body language).

Online, when the herd approaches, what sets any one of these guys apart? A clever opener perhaps, but there's got to be more to it...I'm wondering if it devolves into nothing more than a catalogue. She flips through it, not reading the descriptions, and then picks the cutest outfit, THEN reads the description...I wonder if it devolves to basically be all about how attractive they think you are OR if they just stop caring because it's just to much stimulus.

[Guest]

[LEFT]It's been 72 hours:[/LEFT]


[LEFT]Hits: 524 (only 336 unique viewers)
Emails Received: 65
Winks Received: 112
Times Favorited: 13
Men Interested: 44 (these are outside of winks/emails)
IM Requests: ~ 20[/LEFT]

[LEFT]Profile seems to have gotten a second wind. I keep updating it every day so that helps keep it at the top of the searches.[/LEFT]

[LEFT]Most guys clearly do not read the profile. Most openers appear to be canned. One guy said he went to SMU too, profile says she went to UT. I busted the shit out of him on that one.[/LEFT]

[LEFT]Best opener so far (keep in mind that this line is her profile: "Manufactured in Europe and recently naturalized by Uncle Sam"):[/LEFT]

[LEFT][COLOR=red]Subject: Imports[/COLOR][/LEFT]

[LEFT][COLOR=red]You can't just say 'manufactured in Europe' and not tell where. French watchmakers could have assembled you.[/COLOR][/LEFT]


I thought that was pretty clever. So, I checked out his profile:

[COLOR=blue]Header: Tandem Lives[/COLOR]

[COLOR=blue]I'm a jeweler. I have two tattoos on my left and right shoulders. I smoke like a chimney. I'm anti-social at times. I have two cats, neither of which are sane. Neither am I. I read too much for my own good. I'm arrogantly humble. I have a DIY ethos. I have two bachelor's degrees, a master's and want to pursue my PhD. I make my presence known in a room (not quite sure how). I let my mouth run when I open it. I don't open my mouth much. I feel much older than I am and I'm not as old as I'd like to be. [/COLOR]
[COLOR=blue]I like bar-hopping and dancing badly, watching a movie with something to pet (a cat or a woman's hair, either one works), eating well but not a lot, driving fast, meditating and a sleepy Sunday morning.[/COLOR]

[COLOR=blue]I don't care much for drama. I do care a lot about my family. [/COLOR]
[COLOR=blue]I believe in the Lord God, but not quite how you think. Jesus is not my friend. He's the son of God. Show some damn respect. [/COLOR]

[COLOR=blue]I listen to far too much music and barely any of it you can find on the radio. I'm a bit snobbish about my tastes. I enjoy a good dive as much as fine dining. I'm not comfortable around the beautiful people. I take care to dress well. [/COLOR]

[COLOR=blue]Penguins are my favorite animal. Rats and stool pigeons are not. [/COLOR]
[COLOR=blue]I'm not your perfect match. I'm not 6ft tall, hip, slick and bulletproof. I have a twisted sense of humor. I have a whacked-out sense of right and wrong. And I don't expect perfection. [/COLOR]

[COLOR=blue]My ideal woman is, well, ideal. She's not real. I'd like a real woman please.[/COLOR]

There are a handful of times in which he disqualifies himself, but all-in-all, the profile is one of the better ones I've run into. Seriously.

If he cleaned out the religious rant. Got rid of some of the self-disqualifiers (which happens way too much in these guy's profile), then I think he'd have some solid responses. His pics don't help him, but they don't hurt him either.

Sad that the one of the best profile still sucks.

Here's another one that I think is pretty neutral:

[COLOR=blue]Your mom would approve[/COLOR]

[COLOR=blue]Ok Dallas girls...stop boring me! This is a major city and there must be something more interesting...........that's probably a bit crass but just being upfront and honest. The Uptown persona is fun, but not substantive. [/COLOR]

[COLOR=blue]Let's see...what should I put to give a glimpse of me? I am well educated both formally and informally through. I thoroughly enjoy my job and to supplement my days, I try to stay active in the community through a variety of means. I think that it is important to have a balance in one's life. For instance, I am involved in local politics which is certainly interesting. [/COLOR]

[COLOR=blue]I am an extremely introspective person. It's fun to philosophize in addition to how it makes you grow. So, I welcome the same in significant other, actually prefer. I want to meet someone who is fun and intelligent with a curiosity about life. Someone who can keep me on my toes. I want her to have a presence that people notice when she enters a room that makes me proud to be with her. [/COLOR]

[COLOR=blue]Say hi if you are at all interested or want to know more, and I will reply in kind. You will find out that I am far from boring. [/COLOR]

[COLOR=blue]Have a good day. [/COLOR]

[COLOR=blue]Also, please no winks. They aren't very personal and they show me that you are too shy for me anyway. If you want to say "hi" then please do so.[/COLOR]

[COLOR=black]I think his language isn't strong enough and he doesn't seem to have much of a personality. BUT, there are some disqualifers that he uses in here that are effective. I.e. the first paragraph. Still, I find the profile to be neutral. He's a good looking, successful guy so I think he probably does OK. I would drop the wink comment. Women don't want to send guys emails, they just want to wink and let us do the work. I think that hurts him A LOT. Giving a woman a hoop to jump through just to contact you never helps...unless you're a rockstar or really high status.[/COLOR]

I'll post the girl's profile after I take it down. Don't want to compromise the study. Pics + written profile.

[Guest]

The first guy seems like he knows a little bit more about what he needs to do to be attractive, he's just trying WAY too hard imo. But I don't do online dating, so maybe that's just accepted. But I read that, and it just pops out at me how hard he's trying to be different/mysterious/etc and it comes across as beta.

The second guy sucks balls. Everything about that profile is weak. From the first sentence onward. I take that back - the only thing about it that's good is that he states what he's looking for in a woman. So anytime he talks about himself in any way he lowers his value.

[Guest]

Where you the profile I sent my penis pics to? If so, my bad, I didn't know