repeating LTR issue

[Guest]

i repeatedly find myself encountering this situation in LTRs. I'm interested in some other viewpoints or comments.

Every LTR i'm in, about the 6 month mark we begin a conflicting struggle. I have a wide variety of interests and pastimes that are individual activities. I'd also consider them reasonable constructive pastimes. I'm almost never "looking for something to do" or need someone to help occupy my time.

However, as LTRs progress, i get into the constant issue of my time commitment to an LTR. It always happens around this time period. They want more and more time investment into the LTR. Bear in mind i do give 3-4 days a week..1-2 weeknights, and almost entire weekends most of the time (hence my disappearance from community activities). It's just something i'm unwilling to compromise on(i should say MORE, since i already have to get up to this amount), is my time to pursue my own interests. I've seen this pattern with enough women that i don't think it's an isolated case or 2.

This is related to the "community matrix" thread for me, and the noise I deal with in an LTR. After getting this area down, i just have that attitude of "my way or the highway". However i want to actually get past this hurdle not just go through life with a series of LTRs.

This is a slippery slope downward in an LTR since this starts to spill over into everything for me(and also the woman) so i'm interested in hearing thoughts. Do others see this?

[Guest]

Yes, I think this is very normal.

Personally, I see this as a question of flat out standing up for youself and being honest and direct about what you want in a relationship.

You have every right to some time to yourself to pursue your own interests, and from the women I've talked to there are a good number who want exactly the same thing in a man that you do a woman - especially many of the the more career-minded, intelligent, and succesful women out there who are looking for a relationship but also have their own aspirations.

Have you had a talk with your girl on this one? I'd be willing to bet that your independence and your aspirations to achieve and do things outside the relationship is very attractive to her, and at the same time it preocupies her. Women are wierd like that.

My own LTR is that way. I am also very independent and need time to myself, but so is she and so does she. So we work out OK even though we live in seperate cities because we see each other quite a bit anyways.

There are times that it starts to take its toll. The key for me has been good communication. Do your best to help her understand what you need in order to be happy with her.

[Guest]

This will not be a different viewpoint, but I cannot help but respond....

Jesus, TD.

I know exactly what you mean.

It seems that as the LTR begins to mature, the woman wants more and more and more and more of YOUR time.

Like you, I need a certain amount of 'Bull Time' so that I can refresh myself, recover, regroup, contemplate, enjoy MYSELF, and be sane and ready for what life has to throw at me.

LTR's commonly just don't get that idea. Women, it seems, want to be with a man, I mean THEIR man, as much as is humanly possible. I think there are a two primary reasons for this: 1) women are biologically wired to seek out protection, men provide that and 2) society has a tilt towards creating certain insecurities amongst women. Therefore, they seek out YOU to rectify to themselves this inconsistencies.

When you get down to it, women have no understanding of the yearning a man has to be free. The reason is that women, typically, allow themselves to be ruled by tyrannts (whether it's their child, parents, friends, society, or their man). Men, on the other hand, rally against the entire idea of tyranny.

The ladies just don't get it. They want a wild mustang, but once they have 'roped' one they pull the rope too tight. When we comply, they let go of the rope...when we pull back, they blame us for being distant or unavailable...

[Guest]

grimm/BR

Yes, i have had those discussions. But as you tapped into, therein lies the paradox. They want that, but soon as they have it, they want to reign it in. Their ability to reign it in weighs heavily on how they view your investment into the LTR (in my experience)

They continually want more and more of your time to validate the relationship.

Pre community TD spent an hour a night engaged in phone conversations with the LTRs on nights we weren't together blowing smoke up each other asses that i HATED, but i didn't know better and was afraid of losing what i had so i was at their mercy. I'll be perfectly honest here, since discovering the community and getting this down, i have not had a 5+ minute phone conversation with any GF in 5+ years. i just don't do it. Now they KNOW not to call me. i don't do phone calls to chat. But that is all from my new frame. They have bought into MY frame now.... "i only call TD if i need urgent exchange of info". I point this out to illustrate i've tried to buffer what is a "day together" from our "alone days"...

So here lies the situation i can't get past. Several LTRs have fallen by the wayside since i do not bend on this matter.

But it goes to the 'community matrix' thread. I realize now that i can immediately replace the initial excitement with a new girl. You lose that vested interest in dealing with the noise of an LTR and these LTR related issues....but I'm not looking to continue this pattern, i'm actually looking to solve it.

[Guest]

[quote1244611224=TopDog]

They continually want more and more of your time to validate the relationship.

[/quote1244611224]

You can't really expect them NOT to want more can you? The normal progression of a relationship is to continually get more and more serious, with each party spending more and more time with each other. This continues until 1. you are living together basically spending every waking hour together outside of work. 2. Marriage

That is how I see it unless of course you let her know up front that you have no interest in marriage.

I don't have an answer to your question and current dilemma. It is very tricky and one in which there is probably several correct solutions and many wrong answers. All of which have to be handled very carefully. I can see taking a path and it blowing up in your face.

In the end though if this girl really cares about you and sees TD as marriage material she will be willing to BEND. If she isn't willing to compromise then fuck her it would have been a shitty marriage anyways and might as well end now.

Open communication is key here.

[Guest]

wow......lol.......yeah I'm in the same boat. Been with the same girl for about 7months and the amount of time I spend with her has gradually increased to the point where I feel like I don't have enough time for myself.

A month ago she started complaining that she felt "distant" from me! She said she felt very connected to me when she was with me on the weekend but felt a total disconnect when we were apart during the week. (haha yeah I have that effect on women, its my pua up-bringing! ;-) )

So she tried to get me to call/text her more but that really isn't my deal. So I told her she could stay at my house on Wednesday nights. My plan was to cut out some of the time I spend with her on the weekend and apply that to Wednesday night.........hahaha yeah that idea didn't work.

When she stays the night at my house its guaranteed she's staying majority of the next fuckin' day during the weekend.

Lately I have started staying at her house so I can get up in the morning and leave. She pouts when I roll out early but I can escape to my freedom.

Last weekend she was with me the majority of the time. So when my buddy asked me to ride with him to Lake Texoma to check out his boatslip and come back I said yes. I figured she could just come along or go home if she didn't want to go! I mean fuck, I had given her almost the entire damn weekend, what was a few hours on Sunday afternoon.

It didn't bother me at all that she went, however it did piss me off when she said "I wanted to spend time with just us". I'm like........hooker, I've been with you damn near 24-7 this weekend and you are complaining about a couple hours with one of my boys????? She is lucky I even asked her to go.

I swear I spend more time with my ltr than I did my wife! Maybe thats why my marriage failed. I know it had somthing to do with it. If you want one of these LTR's to survive, you are going to have to compromise to some extent.

She doesn't have any hobbies that she can consume herself with. She's figured out that she has more fun hanging out with me than she does her girlfriends so she has almost stopped going out with them.

A wise old man once told me to find a woman that has a hobby other than herself. The more women I go through the more i realize how important that is. I just don't find many attractive women that have hobbies.

So perhaps it would be beneficial for any LTR to make sure she has a hobby she can occupy her time and mind with or lead her that way. This will free time up for you!

One thing I've done that seems to help is stand firm on what plans I might have and inform her ahead of time. I don't think there is an ultimate solution to any of it. Its about sacrifices and finding a balance that both parties are happy with. If you want a strong committed relationship, then you have to compromise some of your personal activities that you might do alone.

Looking back on my marriage I see that I had more time for myself! Its because my wife did her thing and I did mine. But that kind of behavior over time caused us to drift apart. With my girlfriend, I find myself busier than ever before. I feel like I never have enough time in the day to get everything done. I am also spending more quality time with my gf and have a fairly successful relationship with her as a result. So what I'm trying to say here is you have to find some balance. My exwife taught me that if you aren't going to keep your woman happy, then she'll find some other schmuck that will! And we all know women with value(looks&brains) all have a line of guys waiting for an opportunity.

[Guest]

Why do we have to have this idea that a relationship is about progressing? Women are always wanting to take the next step, but sometimes there is no next step in the relationship.

I mean, shit. You say to a girl that you love them, that you're exclusive, what the fuck else do they need? You move in with them, you get married, you have kids. What the fuck else is there? But, no, they always want more and more and more and more from you.

More time, more security, more companionship, more, more, more, more.

In my opinion, I think this is how things REALLY work.

-Boy meets girl.
-Boy has a LIFE outside of girl making him a challenge for girl.
-Girl falls for boy.
-Girl goes out of her way to get the boy.
-Boy falls for girl because she's cool and let's me do my thing. (How many times have you thought this before?)
-Girl slowly starts tightening the reigns.
-Boy doesn't notice the lessening of his freedom because girl is implementing incrementalism...small bites you know?

Then, one of two things happen. The boy commits or marries girl OR boy wakes up and tries to take back the territory that girl has taken.

The problem?

Once they take you're freedom, it's gone. You cannot get it back with her. All because of this idea of progressing in a relationship.

Sometimes, the best progression is one in which you are content with your relationship and you turn your efforts to improving the rest of your life. Sure, to Howie's point, you MIGHT grow apart. But, that's life man. People grow apart all the fucking time. It's tragic, it sucks, but that's life man.

This notion of happily ever after is great and all. But, why do we have this silly idea that a man needs a woman to fulfill his life and vice versa? Why can't we simply be together but still have our time to ourselves? Shit, the most successful relationships I've ever seen are ones in which one, or both, travel for work. Distance makes the heart grow founder. (You can create this by having your own time to do your own thing).

I've said this once, I'll say it again. You want an H frame relationship, not an A frame relationship.

You want her to have her own life, with her own shit...you want to have your own life with your own shit. Then, come together to share your experiences. You don't want to constantly be around each other. You loose your individuality. And, when you do that, women begin to not respect you. When that happens, she leaves.

[Guest]

[quote1244653039=Bull Run]
Why do we have to have this idea that a relationship is about progressing? Women are always wanting to take the next step, but sometimes there is no next step in the relationship.

I mean, shit. You say to a girl that you love them, that you're exclusive, what the fuck else do they need? You move in with them, you get married, you have kids. What the fuck else is there? But, no, they always want more and more and more and more from you.

More time, more security, more companionship, more, more, more, more.

In my opinion, I think this is how things REALLY work.

-Boy meets girl.
-Boy has a LIFE outside of girl making him a challenge for girl.
-Girl falls for boy.
-Girl goes out of her way to get the boy.
-Boy falls for girl because she's cool and let's me do my thing. (How many times have you thought this before?)
-Girl slowly starts tightening the reigns.
-Boy doesn't notice the lessening of his freedom because girl is implementing incrementalism...small bites you know?

Then, one of two things happen. The boy commits or marries girl OR boy wakes up and tries to take back the territory that girl has taken.

The problem?

Once they take you're freedom, it's gone. You cannot get it back with her. All because of this idea of progressing in a relationship.

Sometimes, the best progression is one in which you are content with your relationship and you turn your efforts to improving the rest of your life. Sure, to Howie's point, you MIGHT grow apart. But, that's life man. People grow apart all the fucking time. It's tragic, it sucks, but that's life man.

This notion of happily ever after is great and all. But, why do we have this silly idea that a man needs a woman to fulfill his life and vice versa? Why can't we simply be together but still have our time to ourselves? Shit, the most successful relationships I've ever seen are ones in which one, or both, travel for work. Distance makes the heart grow founder. (You can create this by having your own time to do your own thing).

I've said this once, I'll say it again. You want an H frame relationship, not an A frame relationship.

You want her to have her own life, with her own shit...you want to have your own life with your own shit. Then, come together to share your experiences. You don't want to constantly be around each other. You loose your individuality. And, when you do that, women begin to not respect you. When that happens, she leaves.
[/quote1244653039]

amen to every damn sentence

[Guest]

[quote1244684995=TopDog]
I'll be perfectly honest here, since discovering the community and getting this down, i have not had a 5+ minute phone conversation with any GF in 5+ years. i just don't do it.
[/quote1244684995]

haha holy fuck. i'm literally astonished. you have achieved what no man in history has achieved. they'll write songs in your honor and tell stories of you when you're gone.

he's a pro, don't try this one at home kids.

[Guest]

This is for general interest I suppose. It's a question posted by a girl on an ask/answer website I am a member of. Really shows that many women think exactly the same way you do.


"In a relationship, is "two becoming one" a good idea or is it better to stay individuals in a partnership? My bf doesn't think I am invested enough in our relationship and accuses me of "thinking like a single person". I disagree. I merely just want to stay my own person. I love him, but I don't think we have to "merge" and become ONE person so to speak.


- Asked by Female, 29-35


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i agree with you.
some guy was talking about how he wants to "become one" with a partner and i thought "ewww..."
what the hell does that mean anyway???

my view for love is similar to yours.



- Response by laylayla, An Alternative Girl, Female, 22-25, Who Cares? Rating Received:

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two are not one.. relationships are full of compromise but you have to be individuals as well or there will be resentment



- Response by smartblond, A Sweet Sarah, Female, Who Cares?, Charlotte, Self-Employed Rating Received:

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Your going to have to be more specific than that.From what you said all I can invision is you two mergeing into one person in a flash of light then walking off with his face on one side and yours on the other.

What is causing the problem?Living together,sharing exspenses or savings,kocking da boots or what?



- Response by justme38271, A Mr. Married Guy, Male, 36-45, Consulting Rating Received:

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Yes, you do..if you want to last.



- Response by maxxfighter, A Career Man, Male, 29-35, Financial / Banking Rating Received:

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Your BF is confused. Giving up individuality is a huge, HUGE mistake.

IMO, in a healthy relationship, there are 3 people, or really, 3 lives, if you will.

HIS individual life
YOUR individual life
and the JOINT life that overlaps and you share together.

He must read romance novels or something, because not many guys think like that. Apparently he neither likes, nor desires, independence of any sort, or he's afraid of you having any independence.

Regardless, it's an unhealthy way of thinking.




- Response by steve67, A Rebel, Male, Who Cares?, New York, Who Cares? Rating Received:

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That statement is part of the verbal contractual spew attributed to marriage within a church. I feel it's a statement of patriarchy and comes out of an idea that you become the man's property. I think people who stand by this notion are actually fearful of their partner remaining individuals. They don't like the idea that there could be disagreement or conflict that they might have to bend on. I also think it is born of a notion of combining assets and alliances which was often the underpinning of arranged unions within certain groups.
I'm not buying it. I've never seen anything in nature become one after mating. And except for geese and a subspecies of voles...there isn't much monogamy out there either. Within an egalitarian society females AND males for that matter should maintain enough of their individuality as to be able to be fully functioning as adults should the relationship fail. It's how we operate in ever other relationship if we intend it to be healthy.




- Response by joybird, A Creative, Female, 46-55, Rochester, Who Cares?