I think I'm a total mysogonist at times

[Bull Run]

Often times, I've come home from the bars empty handed, beating myself up, trying to figure out what the fuck I did wrong. If only I'd have done this at this point or done this at that point...I'd be getting laid right now.

It sounds as if you stake too much on closing a chick. I never judge the success of my sarging on how many girls I pulled. Instead I judge my night by asking myself a couple of questions:

1) Was I always confident in my approaches and interactions with others?
2) Did I have a good time?
3) Did I meet some cool, new people?
4) Was I social and spoke with as many people as I could?

If the answer is yes to all of the above, then it was a good night. And, I guarantee that if you strive to check 'yes' for each of the above then you probably did close some chicks. I think a lot of guys sarge for the sake of closing a chick. That's the goal sure, but you can't let that be your singular focus. Be social, have a good time, the girls will follow.

The bottom line is, the woman is the chooser. We're the chasers. There is no changing that. We approach them, not the other way around. We call them in phone game, not the other way around.

Only initially, only at the time of the approach. After that, you're the one that chooses. With that frame, I've found that girls actually call me before I ever get a chance to call them. I know A LOT of guys on the board can say the same about themselves.

And getting a woman to fall madly in love with you is like trying to negotiate a friggin' mine field. One wrong step and you're dead. Make an approach and start asking typical interview questions (where do you work, where are you from, etc) = BLOWN OUT. Allow a lull in the conversation after you open a set (doesn't matter that she has no personality) you are BLOWN OUT. Phone game, voice mail and unreturned voice mails. Flakes. Showing jealousy too soon. Calling too much. Acting needy. Texting too much. All of these are mines in the mine field and there's usually not a second chance. In other words, we're rejected.

Sure, sure a lot of this is true. But you learn how to calibrate yourself, it just takes time, practice, success, and even rejection.

I have dealt with so much fucking rejection over my lifetime, YES, deep down inside I think I hate women for it.

I think I speak for a lot of the guys here when I say that we've all experienced a ton of rejection. It sucks, but YOU'RE the REASON for the rejection. It's all on you. Quick story, I used to be a fat guy. Like 270+ as a Junior in college, sure I'm about 6' but still that's fat. I dealt with rejection on a massive scale growing up because of my weight (I've since lost it). I've had girls laugh in my face, throw drinks on me, give me speeches about why they would ever be interested in a fat ass like me, etc. After losing the weight things changed, for the first time in my life women were into me based on how I looked. Eventually I realized that I was the reason for getting rejected because I never gave them a compelling reason to be attracted to me.

You are selling a product and that product is you.

I'm not selling anything. I'm out there buying. Women are so socially intuitive that they can sense this, they can sniff it out. When you try to 'sell' yourself, women can tell and are immediately turned off period.

So yes, I want to break their hearts into a thousand tiny pieces to get even with woman-kind for all the feelings of rejection that I've felt in the past.

You won't break any hearts with this mentality. Women will know, they will sense it, and they will run in the opposite direction. Drop the ill feelings towards women otherwise you're setting yourself up for rejection on a massive scale.

All's fair in love and war.

It's not love and it's not war, it's being social. Be social, women will follow.

[Tribulus1000]

BullRun nailed it.

I was gonna say something but I thought it might come off as a flame or a put down.

But really pay attention to what BullRun is trying to say. These are beliefs that we are dealing with here.

For example, alot of guys have the "we're at war" frame with women and its very counterproductive.
Truth is, this is not war. This is not revenge. Its quite the opposite.

If the goal of this message board is to help eachother out and to reach our goals then I think this post is a reflection of that.

[Alphagame]

Bull Run,

You have the right mentality...you aren't selling, your buying...but at the end of the day, you walk into a bar...doesn't matter that you're hotter than Tom Cruise (I've actually had a woman tell me that)...if you don't make the approach, you're going home alone. Women seldom make the approach. I mean, it does happen from time to time, but it's seldom. Women simply don't approach me.

Approach = sales call, whether you want to call it that or not. That's what it is. And unless you lose interest before she does, if you approach her and you don't fuck her at least 5 different times, you're being rejected for who you are. YOU are the REASON for the rejection. I'll agree with that. Maybe you're new to the "game" and you came off as nervous on the approach. Maybe your phone game is horrible. Maybe your sex was horrible and she was turned off. Whatever the reason, the odds of her rejecting you before you reject her are tremendous. And it is "YOU" in the current state of "YOU" that she's rejecting. We tell ourselves not to take it personally, but apply just a tad bit of logic, and yes, there's no getting around it...YOU are being rejected for being YOU.

I've had sex with 5 different women in my life who I fucked on more than 5 different occassions. No telling how many women I've approached. No telling how many women I've kissed. No telling how many women I've dated and fucked. But only FIVE of them would have me repeatedly. A few, I lost interest in, but for the most part, I was rejected at some point along the way by all but 5 of them.

Now that I understand this stupid game as well as I do, I'll soon be adding 6 & 7 and hopefully several more this year. But isn't it amazing that of the dozens of women I've banged, I wanted to see most of them again, but at the end of the day only FIVE of them would have me repeatedly??? I'm telling you, it's a friggin' mine field full of rejection. Now that I'm at a certain level of "game"...sorry for being human, but now that I'm completely over any resemblence of one-itis...yes, I want to get even with woman-kind...at least in my mind...at least for now.

Oddly, when you have a girlfriend, even if it's never brought up, she'll somehow sense it and the "game" gets a lot easier. They're attracted to what they can't have. That's why I say women are their own worst enemy. That's why I'll ALWAYS have at least two girlfriends from this day forward. I'll never bring up relationship talk with a woman again. I'll never tell a woman "I love you" again, even if I do. I've fallen victim to the tear gas, learned my lesson and from here on out, I'll ALWAYS have at least 2 girlfriends. I've told women "I love you" only to have them manipulate me "If you really loved me, you'd..." And yes, I'm always gonna be looking for a brighter, shinier object so the odds of me dumping them before they get bored and dump me...somebody's gonna get their heart broken...I just hope it's not me.

[JP2008]

I agree with your perception that in most cases women only want relationships with those that do not want them but I also think you are an offical member of the He-Man Woman Haters Club and I think that is only going to hurt you in the long run.

It is all perception and its stupid but women want to feel like they are not settling. When they enter into a relationship they want to feel that they got something that was originally just outside their reach. The guy they wind up with may actually not be as attractive, well rounded or interesting as the guy they pushed away but that does not register with them because what drove them to chase the guy they wound up with was the fact that they had to chase him, that they got something they did not necessarily deserve.

Sure I agree that this can lead you to despise women espically when you think back to the ones who may have pushed you away in the past only to enter into a relationship with someone who was not that great and who did not care that much about them but the fact is that it is the nature of most women and if you like women in some as much as the rest of us do then you just have to at some point realize its just their nature. Lets be honest fellas how many times have we cheated? Honestly I know I have done that, I know given the oppurtunity most all of us would and most often do but thats just our nature. People are very flawed and it sucks but what other option do we have, its what makes us human.

[Dragon]

I think I speak for a lot of the guys here when I say that we've all experienced a ton of rejection. It sucks, but YOU'RE the REASON for the rejection. It's all on you. Quick story, I used to be a fat guy. Like 270+ as a Junior in college, sure I'm about 6' but still that's fat. I dealt with rejection on a massive scale growing up because of my weight (I've since lost it). I've had girls laugh in my face, throw drinks on me, give me speeches about why they would ever be interested in a fat ass like me, etc. After losing the weight things changed, for the first time in my life women were into me based on how I looked. Eventually I realized that I was the reason for getting rejected because I never gave them a compelling reason to be attracted to me.

Great post BullRun...

Instead of fat... I thought women weren't attracted to me because of my race. For Example, when my brother went to Hong Kong, he told me he was being hit on left and right by asian chick. All this time, I was thinking it was because I am chinese in a white place and I don't measure up. But in reality, my brother (not PUA) had confidence and ambition, it didn't matter where he was. I need to get in that frame of mind.

[Dragon]

...I'll never bring up relationship talk with a woman again. I'll never tell a woman "I love you" again, even if I do. I've fallen victim to the tear gas, learned my lesson and from here on out, I'll ALWAYS have at least 2 girlfriends. I've told women "I love you" only to have them manipulate me "If you really loved me, you'd..."

Very wise words. Very hard to follow. I always get sucker by some girl's eyes.

[playercool]

Alpha Alpha Alpha. Man you have some inner issues you really need to resolve. I guarantee this is bleeding from your demeanor and women are picking up on it. I am not trying to be a jerk. I know others prob don't even want to respond to your post as they don't want to come off as dicks.

So you are a good looking guy badass man. The cards are already stacked in your favor. This doesn't mean you don't have to approach. I have a friend is is Model material. I mean this guy makes me look like shit. Every girl in any joint will think this guy is sexy. Even with this he won't approach girls. I have to literally open sets and bring them to him. The only way he gets girls is from social circles. So yes you have to approach big deal. Girls aren't picking you you are picking them. Yah let that marinate in your brain for a while. You are the selector. She is lucky if you select and seduce her.

You really need to get blown out 100 times on purpose just to get past this rejection. Man I don't even think about rejection. I sometimes say the stupidest shit just to get blown out. Just to judge reactions and cross lines. I do this because the set and the girl(s) doesn't matter to me. It is almost as if you are putting every girl you sarge on a pedastel. Stop that. They are nothing.

You need to step away from everything for a second and reflect on all aspects of your life. Then start reflecting on the game. You need to get whatever is fucked up in your head outta there. The problems you are having in your different aspects of game are your problems. By breaking hearts you will not cure these problems. You will be sitting there thinking WTF why do I still feel the same way? I'm telling you man your problems are right there in your inner self. You make those go away and you will be the biggest pimp. Every girl you fuck once you will fuck 12 times or however many you want. Girls will be calling you up and you will have crazy selection.

I hope you figure it out man. Someone needs to sit down an have an eye opener of a conversation with you. This somehow needs to sink into your head. What you are feeling and dwelling on is gonna mess you up and your game.

Goodluck

[Bull Run]

Women simply don't approach me.

I'm pretty sure everyone of the board will say the same thing. I've been opened before, but not usually by any girl with high value.

Approach = sales call, whether you want to call it that or not. That's what it is.

It's only a sales call when you have the frame that you're trying to get something from her. Don't try, don't be there to try to bed her or pull her number or some bullshit like that. You approach so that you can build a platform from which you begin to decide if you want her. You're giving her an opportunity to give you a reason to want her.

And unless you lose interest before she does, if you approach her and you don't fuck her at least 5 different times, you're being rejected for who you are....We tell ourselves not to take it personally, but apply just a tad bit of logic, and yes, there's no getting around it...YOU are being rejected for being YOU.

I disagree. If a girl has sex with you once and then you never hear from her again isn't rejection. How can you say that's the case? You just fucked her, she accepted you...socially, emotionaly, and physically. Keep in mind too that if she walks away this early in the 'relationship' (i.e. before 5 fucks) she's probably not interest due to something incredibly petty. Just a small aspect of who you are is being rejected, not you as a whole. Girls will dump a guy for the stupidest stuff. Further, no one really knows who you are in such a short period of time...shit, I've known people for months without ever really getting to know them.

But isn't it amazing that of the dozens of women I've banged, I wanted to see most of them again, but at the end of the day only FIVE of them would have me repeatedly???

Maybe that's why they didn't want you any longer. Maybe they knew you liked them more than they liked you. Over my short time the Community I've come to realize that the LESS I appeared to like a girl the MORE she wanted me.

You really need to get blown out 100 times on purpose just to get past this rejection. Man I don't even think about rejection. I sometimes say the stupidest shit just to get blown out. Just to judge reactions and cross lines. I do this because the set and the girl(s) doesn't matter to me. It is almost as if you are putting every girl you sarge on a pedastel. Stop that. They are nothing.

Great point playercool. I did the very same thing and posted about my experience in the Tactics Section.

http://www.dallaspua.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2489

[Alphagame]

I guess my mentality is, it's kinda like being an Oklahoma State football fan your whole life. In my lifetime, the Cowboys are 5-32-1 against the Sooners in football. When you finally beat them, you don't want to just beat those fuckers by a point or two. You want to DESTROY them. Hang a half a hundred on them. Beat the living shit out of them.

I guess I'm kinda the same way with women. Of course, after I get to know them on a personal level, it's not so easy to just break her heart. I know her as *****, the sweet girl with this or that characteristic, who's father beat her as a child or whatever, not as "woman-kind".

But there's only one of me and three girlfriends at once is the maximum and that's really pushing things. As a new girl comes along who's prettier and better, someone's gonna get dumped. I'm not making the same mistakes I've made in the past.

This time, I'm prepared for the teary eyed "I can't handle this" speech. It's bullshit in all likelihood. I'll stand my ground, be non-committal and she'll still decide in the end sharing me is better than not having me at all. And then I'll eventually meet someone better and that'll be the end of her. It'll destroy her, but, like I say, she was her own worst enemy. There's a thousand guys on Match who would be perfect for her if only she wouldn't reject them for being too needy. She can't apply a bit of logic, so she continues to meet guys on Match, good guys with lots of good things going on, but she'll continue to reject every one of those poor bastards until she comes across another ass hole like me who's already got a girlfriend or two. Then she'll fall madly in love with another "player" and repeat the entire process all over again.

++++Maybe that's why they didn't want you any longer. Maybe they knew you liked them more than they liked you. Over my short time the Community I've come to realize that the LESS I appeared to like a girl the MORE she wanted me.++++

Yes, I TOTALLY agree with that. In the past, I'm certain my number one problem was appearing too needy. I'm telling you, that's been the number one thing that's turned my game around 100% the last few months. Just that simple realization, that too much attention early on is REALLY bad. It's nearly impossible to come across as too needy if you've already got a girlfriend or two. Somehow, they sense these things. Woman's intuition, I suppose.

[Bull Run]

Somehow, they sense these things. Woman's intuition, I suppose.

Exactly friend, exactly. And, with this intuition women will pick-up on your disdain for them.