Friday night meetup @ Sherlocks (in-field report)

[Guest]

Happy Monday~

It was nice meeting most of you guys out on Friday. And it was a great experience to sarge for the first time with some more experienced guys to give feedback, tips, suggestions. I got to sample a lot of your styles and I see that they're congruent with who you are. Hopefully we can all do it again, soon.

I opened up several sets that night and I got to observe/wing a few sets with Ram and Smirks...I believe I opened up 3 on my own and will post details below to see about getting some feedback post-sarge:

[B][I][U]Friday Night Meetup at Sherlocks in Addison[/U][/I][/B]

[B][U]#1[/U][/B]

My first set was a 5-set and they were all females mostly attractive with my target being the most attractive one that stood out. They were all surrounding the arcade/video game area and I told Ram and Sooners123 that I will open that set first because it looked quite challenging and indeed it was. I opened with the tried and true MM INDIRECT opinion opener: "who lies more?" I went into the middle of the set
where I felt I could be most vocal and reach out to most of them audiblly and said "hey guys...i got quick question and I can't stay long because i've got to rejoin my friends...but my friends and I have been debating about this all night and we're trying to settle the score: who lies more...men or women?

all girls>> "blah blah blah"

me>> " so why do you feel that way?"

some gir>l> "blah blah blah"

last girl on the very end far right of the 5-set>> "what did he say? what's going on?"
**another girl fills her in**

me>> "well I tell you what we think so far. It's apparent that both men and women lie but it seems to be that women get away with a whole lot more! "

PUA INTERRUPTION>> by some guy that walks in and HUGS the HB target right in front of me

I try to get the set focus back on ME by saying: "so what's up with you guys hovering around the arcade machine?"

one girl>> "because it's less packed and quieter over here..."

**all girls lose attention on me**

me>> "well it was nice talking with you guys" *EJECT*


dealbreakers: 1. not knowing how to better engage EVERYONE in the set
2. wannabe AMOG/BF in the group interrupting my set
3. not having more material to run the indirect game
4. my false time constraint didn't seem to affect them (maybe i need to rock more and pretend like i was leaving)


RAM immediately gave me feedback asking why did I not stay in set and continue plowing? I answered him "honestly I felt the set was shutting me out and the energy levels were dieing down and
I had no more material to DHV and bait any TARGET to give me IOIs. Not once did I get an IOI in that set.



[B][U]#2[/U][/B]

My next set another 5-set that appeared to be two couples and my target a really cute HB7.5. I originally talked to Vector on this one and asked him to go back to the area with me and watch me open up the set with DIRECT game. I was questioning whether that would be a smart idea and he said WHY NOT? I just felt that maybe her group would shut me out but he said GO FOR IT..so i said..LET'S DO IT. We walked back and she disappeared and so we just went back to the main area where everyone was and we talked. Smirks eventually freed up while Vector struck up convo elsewhere....so i told Smirks bout what Vector and I was trying to do and he told me go with a 5th wheel opener next time i see her and I did just that...i told Smirks that she and her crew bounced to a table in a different area and she was standing up alone by herself and I walked right up to her but she turned the other direction (not to avoid me but she was planning to turn anyways) and I awkwardly turn back to to meet her in that direction and opened with " hey! are you a 5th wheel, too? I love my friends and all but they are getting a little too comfortable around me and i'm just looking to make a connection with someone tonight and i thought you were cute ..my name is ______...yours?" she replied back with " my name is Misty and I'm not a 5th wheel...we're all just one big wheel here! there are not standalone wheels....we're a big wheel of fun!" And she told me "i'm a mechanic!" and I said "do you work on micro machines?" she laughed and her freaking short cute little friend comes out of the table and cuts right in the middle between us and hugs my TARGET and i immediately say "hey now, introduce me to your friend, it's the polite thing to do" she introduces us and i smile and look at new friend and say "hi my name is _____ pleasure to meet the rest of the big wheel" and she laughed and walked off to leave us alone..then the big MAMA HEN in the group is sitting there observing and i tell TARGET to introduce me to the big hen and she did and the moment she did...BIG HEN got up in my face all friendly as if she wanted me to game her and my TARGET walked off and I lost it from then on after being kind to the big mama hen, i ejected and walked back up to see SMIRKS and Sooners 123 a few feet away on the stairs in conversation.

immediate feedback from Smirks: I was pecking in too much even though I was standing off to her side

items of interest: 1. no DHV at any point
2. My approach was hybrid Direct/Indirect
3. big mama hen/unattractive obstacle



[B][U]#3[/U][/B]

Last set of the night I told Smirks I was not satisfied in only opening 2 sets and I'd like to open one more set before the night is over with his help in winging me and observing me. We walked around the bar and immediately get an AI (approach invitation) from a HB7.5 blonde..very pretty. And as I walk in front and Smirks following me behind...I cross her and some guy hits on her and she makes eye contact with me and is communicating to me nonverbally that that guy is not her type and we both laugh and that A-hole looks at me and starts to jokingly hit on me and I look at him and say "don't touch me again." I was gonna drop him if he continued and he stopped and int he middle the HB7.5 told me "i really like your hair, you have nice hair!" and i replied with "well I have a brilliant personality, too!" and smirks walks closer and i say "hey come meet my friend, he saved my life recently" and he introduces himself as "Danger ______" and she teases him a little about his name. And the guy standing next to her is just obvserving ( i thought it was her fat BF at first but it turns out he just met her that night and is a friend i guess) I open him and ask him how he knew her. Then while Smirks is talking, I kindly interrupt him so that I can start practicing more and say "okay guys! GET THIS!: this weekend i'm going to attend one of my ex's wedding back home..and i've been catching hell for it from everyone at work, my friends, and whatnot...what do you guys think? HB7.5 says " oh hell no..don't go! I wouldn't ..or GO and bring a HOT DATE!" I reply back "are you inviting yourself? =) " she says "no...*smiles*" then she says "or bring Smirks" etc etc.. her fat guy friend offers his opinions, too, etc... Anyways..the set energy level dies down and i run out of material and eject.

hindsight 20/20: Looking back...I would have done things a little differently when she COMPLIMENTED me. Next time I will say "hey now..your'e gonna have to buy me a drink before you hit on me like that!" and make her invest in me. If she asks "why should I? " or "no way! you buy me one!" and i'm going to say "well think of this drink as an investment. What if this drink nets you something special..you can look back and tell everyone this story of how it all happened" LOL..i dunno..something to that extent


###################################################


Prodigy, it was cool to see you do a # close just for me.

Vector, it was a pleasure to converse with you about my sticking points in DHVing through quick storytelling about recent events I will be partaking in. I took that and ran with it by telling sets what I was going to do over the weekend and that I was going to be attending one of ex's wedding and getting conversation started off of that.

Smirks, I learned how to open sets with a 5th wheel from you and I will try to not peck as much but man it's way too loud in the bar.

Bull Run, didn't mean to hurt your hands but don't ever touch my balls again.

Ram, it was a pleasure watching you smooth sets over with your humor and you remind me of a college party king. lol

Sooners123, I'm glad you bit the bullet and opened up a really challenging hot set. I mean what's the point in opening a set that woudln't normally make you nervous? When you go to the gym, you don't find a 5lb dumbbell to curl, you find one that is challenging for YOU. And you did that. They were quite attractive and you stayed in set for quite a bit of time as we all noticed. Keep opening until you hit your next sticking point. I consider myself an Opener at this point when it comes to INDIRECT GAME and will be doing more HOMEWORK to better my MIDGAME.


At this point, I feel so much more comfortable with direct game in comparison to indirect game and I want to learn TIGHT indirect game so I can use it when needed. Does anyone here have some writeups and specific examples/experiences of INDIRECT game they can share with all of us?


Thanks again for a fun night guys. See you all at the next one. :)

[Guest]

[QUOTE=budgetballer;34061]Bull Run, didn't mean to hurt your hands but don't ever touch my balls again.[/QUOTE]



Hahaha!! I don't even remember that...trust me, I couldn't feel them buddy.

Anyway, don't you know that I'm only in the Game so I can try to play grab ass with guys that aren't all that good with women? It was totally a come on, I'm amazed that no one has caught on to my true intentions before now...

[Guest]

#1
You already know my thoughts on the MM bs...I won't repeat, lol.

[QUOTE=budgetballer;34061]
1. not knowing how to better engage EVERYONE in the set
[/QUOTE]
Did you take notice of how I engaged OUR group? Hand gestures directed at different people at different times, make eye contact with them all at different times, speak louder, etc. It all depends on the person, but I disagree with the MM way of handling body language. They want you to always be super chill and super laid back...well that ain't me. I'm a bit more dramatic with my body language and movement in set...that helps with large groups.


[QUOTE=budgetballer;34061]
2. wannabe AMOG/BF in the group interrupting my set
[/QUOTE]
Did you engage him in conversation, or ignore him? Sounds like you ignored...and if so...THAT did you in. If I walk in to a mixed set, I always address the guy(s) first. If he walks in to the set, be friendly and acknowledge his existence...otherwise he'll make shit difficult/impossible for you. You can always turn a chick's guy friend in to your wing without him even knowing it.


[QUOTE=budgetballer;34061]
3. not having more material to run the indirect game
[/QUOTE]
With all the MM crap you keep pulling out, I'm surprised you couldn't at least continue rolling with, "Did you guys see the fight outside a sec ago?" or whatever.

Granted, they were in the most boring spot in the bar, so work with that. "How's the band over there?", "Did you talk to the guy at the main bar who's faking a British accent?","You're not playing the video game, you're not playing pool, you're not playing darts, and you're not watching the band...so, you're all just standing here looking at each other? Come on...you all look more fun than that. I'm gonna help you get the party started."

[QUOTE=budgetballer;34061]
4. my false time constraint didn't seem to affect them (maybe i need to rock more and pretend like i was leaving)
[/QUOTE]
What outcome do you expect a FTC to have on people who have zero investment in to you? They have no reason to not want you to go away. Rocking "more" will make you seem autistic, paranoid, or on coke.


#2

All I remember about this set was the awkward turning snap back thing that happened when you approached. It was unavoidable, but you recovered well. I was too far away to hear anything, but body language was okay. The pecking was probably done due to the volume of the music, but the frequency of it was causing the girls to move their upper body back a little. If someone can't hear me in a loud environment, wave them a tad closer and repeat with a stronger tone. Mother Hen did blow you out (kindly)...don't be afraid to eject and come back! When you return, the set will be warm, and easier to engage (at least) the target and the hen in conversation at the same time.


[QUOTE=budgetballer;34061]
" hey! are you a 5th wheel, too? I love my friends and all but they are getting a little too comfortable around me and i'm just looking to make a connection with someone tonight and i thought you were cute ..my name is ______...yours?"
[/QUOTE]
"Hey! You look like you're a 5th wheel too. I love my friends and all, but it's getting a little too mushy over there. You caught my eye and seemed to be in the same situation...so I wanted to come say hi." The "looking to make a connection" part seems odd to me.

[QUOTE=budgetballer;34061]
1. no DHV at any point
[/QUOTE]
Having friends was a DHV. If you knew Sooners and I were not too far away and you're having trouble, next time motion for one of us to come over. I gave you the opener and would have easily kept the 5th wheel story going. Honestly, the set never progressed far enough to bother with any kind of DHV. The opener's subject was quickly exhausted, so you would have needed to go on to something else and DHV within that.

[QUOTE=budgetballer;34061]
2. My approach was hybrid Direct/Indirect
[/QUOTE]
Nothing wrong with that. It seems as though it came off natural, and that's all that matters.

[QUOTE=budgetballer;34061]
3. big mama hen/unattractive obstacle
[/QUOTE]
Just like the dude from #1, win her over and *BAM* she's your pivot.


#3
I actually think I killed the vibe of this set. After my little session of entertaining the group, the chick with the glasses who was friends with the girl who's camera I took the battery out of came by...said something snotty to me, and I fired back. The exchange made them feel uncomfortable. Blame the jaeger bombs.

[QUOTE=budgetballer;34061]
Does anyone here have some writeups and specific examples/experiences of INDIRECT game they can share with all of us?
[/QUOTE]
I think you're making it more difficult than it really is. You're still holding on to MM way too tightly. It's not "step one: FTC step two: roll in to opinion opener step three: body rock step four:..." You can't run sets like you run a computer program. The difference between direct an indirect is that with direct you cut to the chase in the beginning, and build from there. Indirect you build up TO your intent.

[Guest]

#1.

You will never entertain a 5 set. Unless you are just some rock star or something forget about it. Or if they are all uggs I guess then it might be possible.

If someone wants to argue this point please correct me. I will come watch you prove me wrong.

So if you hold that mindset then follow along.

5 sets are never going to be organized. By that I mean if you really watch the dynamics of a 5 set they don't usually sit there and hold hands and talk to everyone. They are ALMOST ALWAYS segregated to some extreme. So that means your goal is not to run a 5 set. You goal is to run a 2 set or a 3 set. If someone from one of the other sets busts in wanting to know what is going on NEG her. She can easily steal the set if you let her.

One other possibility is to engage 1 person of the group. Yes, this is very possible since it is a 5 set. Girls can leave the others alone because they have plenty of others to talk with. So engaging only one girl of the group is highly possible and it is how I pulled some of the hotter girls in my day.

[Guest]

[QUOTE=playercool;34065]#1.

You will never entertain a 5 set. Unless you are just some rock star or something forget about it. Or if they are all uggs I guess then it might be possible.

If someone wants to argue this point please correct me. I will come watch you prove me wrong.

So if you hold that mindset then follow along.

5 sets are never going to be organized. By that I mean if you really watch the dynamics of a 5 set they don't usually sit there and hold hands and talk to everyone. They are ALMOST ALWAYS segregated to some extreme. So that means your goal is not to run a 5 set. You goal is to run a 2 set or a 3 set. If someone from one of the other sets busts in wanting to know what is going on NEG her. She can easily steal the set if you let her.

One other possibility is to engage 1 person of the group. Yes, this is very possible since it is a 5 set. Girls can leave the others alone because they have plenty of others to talk with. So engaging only one girl of the group is highly possible and it is how I pulled some of the hotter girls in my day.[/QUOTE]

Yeah, agreed. I mean, it may be possible, but it isn't necessary. A 5-set, which is now a 6-set because you're in it, breaks up nicely.

Btw dude, I like your report. Looks like you had a fun night. Only two comments:

1 - In all 3 sets, you ejected because you were uncomfortable. If I were you, I'd stay in. Force yourself to stay in, at least at this stage. It trains you to deal with social pressure, to come up with things to say, to push interactions. And you never know: your results may improve.

2 - Open more sets. Don't know about other people, but the first couple of sets are throwaway sets for me. I'm not talkative, not too funny, and it takes me a few blowouts for that to change. Which is why I hate it when the first set hooks.

[Guest]

I agree with playercool. With such a large set, you don't need to entertain everyone. The non-targets of the group will normally entertain themselves, and in some situations you could probably even focus only on the girl you're gaming.

It was a fun night. I'll definitely get over my AA very soon.

[Guest]

When taking on large sets, you don't have to entertain them all every second you're there, but it really isn't hard to entertain 5 people or so. Talk to a couple, pull in another...one will probably drop off and do something else, etc etc. It really isn't hard. That's what I did w/ the bachelorette party w/ Prodigy.

[Guest]

[QUOTE=Smirks;34064]#1
You already know my thoughts on the MM bs...I won't repeat, lol.

[COLOR=green]haha no love for the MM...[/COLOR]

Did you take notice of how I engaged OUR group? Hand gestures directed at different people at different times, make eye contact with them all at different times, speak louder, etc. It all depends on the person, but I disagree with the MM way of handling body language. They want you to always be super chill and super laid back...well that ain't me. I'm a bit more dramatic with my body language and movement in set...that helps with large groups.



Did you engage him in conversation, or ignore him? Sounds like you ignored...and if so...THAT did you in. If I walk in to a mixed set, I always address the guy(s) first. If he walks in to the set, be friendly and acknowledge his existence...otherwise he'll make shit difficult/impossible for you. You can always turn a chick's guy friend in to your wing without him even knowing it.
[COLOR=green] [/COLOR]
[COLOR=green] Yeah I would classify it as ignoring him because when he came in, he went straight for my target and ignored me. What's a good way to acknowledge him if he's going in and hugging the target and ignoring everyone else in the set?[/COLOR]


With all the MM crap you keep pulling out, I'm surprised you couldn't at least continue rolling with, "Did you guys see the fight outside a sec ago?" or whatever.


Granted, they were in the most boring spot in the bar, so work with that. "How's the band over there?", "Did you talk to the guy at the main bar who's faking a British accent?","You're not playing the video game, you're not playing pool, you're not playing darts, and you're not watching the band...so, you're all just standing here looking at each other? Come on...you all look more fun than that. I'm gonna help you get the party started."

[COLOR=green]I like the bit of where I'm hinting that they are boring(subtley) and I can help them get the party started but can you give some examples on how to go from there? Should I be entertaining them through routines? stories? lead the conversation down a different path? or have them go on those mini-missions you've talked about i.e. getting guys to buy them drinks, etc [/COLOR]

What outcome do you expect a FTC to have on people who have zero investment in to you? They have no reason to not want you to go away. Rocking "more" will make you seem autistic, paranoid, or on coke.

:D

#2

All I remember about this set was the awkward turning snap back thing that happened when you approached. It was unavoidable, but you recovered well. I was too far away to hear anything, but body language was okay. The pecking was probably done due to the volume of the music, but the frequency of it was causing the girls to move their upper body back a little. If someone can't hear me in a loud environment, wave them a tad closer and repeat with a stronger tone. Mother Hen did blow you out (kindly)...don't be afraid to eject and come back! When you return, the set will be warm, and easier to engage (at least) the target and the hen in conversation at the same time.
[COLOR=green] [/COLOR]
[COLOR=green]Thanks, I have yet to re-engage a set where I feel I was blown out. In my next sarge, I will attempt that and push my comfort zone a bit more. What are some solid examples of re-opening?[/COLOR]


"Hey! You look like you're a 5th wheel too. I love my friends and all, but it's getting a little too mushy over there. You caught my eye and seemed to be in the same situation...so I wanted to come say hi." The "looking to make a connection" part seems odd to me.

[COLOR=green]I thought it was odd, too, Smirks! But whether you remember or not, I got that from you! lmfao and I asked you like 3x about whether I should say that because it felt weird. Shiet, were you drunk when you told me that? lol[/COLOR]

Having friends was a DHV. If you knew Sooners and I were not too far away and you're having trouble, next time motion for one of us to come over. I gave you the opener and would have easily kept the 5th wheel story going. Honestly, the set never progressed far enough to bother with any kind of DHV. The opener's subject was quickly exhausted, so you would have needed to go on to something else and DHV within that.

[COLOR=green]Word.[/COLOR]

Nothing wrong with that. It seems as though it came off natural, and that's all that matters.


Just like the dude from #1, win her over and *BAM* she's your pivot.

[COLOR=green]Yeah, it's funny how I'm more affected by mother hens and random dudes than the sight of hot women. I will need to turn it up a couple of notches and work on gaming/dhv'ing to those obstacles like I do in my DIRECT game. I never thought of it that way in INDIRECT game.[/COLOR]

#3
I actually think I killed the vibe of this set. After my little session of entertaining the group, the chick with the glasses who was friends with the girl who's camera I took the battery out of came by...said something snotty to me, and I fired back. The exchange made them feel uncomfortable. Blame the jaeger bombs.

:) [COLOR=green]damn jaeger bombs.[/COLOR]

I think you're making it more difficult than it really is. You're still holding on to MM way too tightly. It's not "step one: FTC step two: roll in to opinion opener step three: body rock step four:..." You can't run sets like you run a computer program. The difference between direct an indirect is that with direct you cut to the chase in the beginning, and build from there. Indirect you build up TO your intent.[/QUOTE]

[COLOR=green]Well I'm still learning and haven't envisioned myself running complete game in the INDIRECT method yet. And a lot of it is baiting the IOIs from the target..it's rare on the occasion that I can bait IOIs from the target(s) in Indirect game whereas in DIRECT game it's always like 90% that I get IOIs from my target(s).[/COLOR]
[COLOR=green] [/COLOR]

[Guest]

[QUOTE=playercool;34065]#1.

You will never entertain a 5 set. Unless you are just some rock star or something forget about it. Or if they are all uggs I guess then it might be possible.

If someone wants to argue this point please correct me. I will come watch you prove me wrong.

So if you hold that mindset then follow along.

5 sets are never going to be organized. By that I mean if you really watch the dynamics of a 5 set they don't usually sit there and hold hands and talk to everyone. They are ALMOST ALWAYS segregated to some extreme. So that means your goal is not to run a 5 set. You goal is to run a 2 set or a 3 set. If someone from one of the other sets busts in wanting to know what is going on NEG her. She can easily steal the set if you let her.

One other possibility is to engage 1 person of the group. Yes, this is very possible since it is a 5 set. Girls can leave the others alone because they have plenty of others to talk with. So engaging only one girl of the group is highly possible and it is how I pulled some of the hotter girls in my day.[/QUOTE]

[COLOR=green]Playercool, let's say a gal jumps into the conversation that I opened with 2 or 3 of the girls...what's a neg example you would employ on the interrupting girl? [/COLOR]

[Guest]

[QUOTE=Lazarus;34067]Yeah, agreed. I mean, it may be possible, but it isn't necessary. A 5-set, which is now a 6-set because you're in it, breaks up nicely.

Btw dude, I like your report. Looks like you had a fun night. Only two comments:

1 - In all 3 sets, you ejected because you were uncomfortable. If I were you, I'd stay in. Force yourself to stay in, at least at this stage. It trains you to deal with social pressure, to come up with things to say, to push interactions. And you never know: your results may improve.

2 - Open more sets. Don't know about other people, but the first couple of sets are throwaway sets for me. I'm not talkative, not too funny, and it takes me a few blowouts for that to change. Which is why I hate it when the first set hooks.[/QUOTE]


[COLOR=green]Well I tried to stay in and change the thread immediately but they weren't willing to invest any in the interaction once the topic was changed and they turned their bodies away from me. Would you still recommend to stay in? I consider that pretty much a blowout so I ejected as soon as I saw them turn their bodies. If there are ways to stay in and plow, I am definitely interested in learning that strategy/technique...[/COLOR]