Dallas PUA

The most unattractive thing we can do as men is to give away our power. Period.

ALL REACTION SEEKING BEHAVIOR GIVES AWAY POWER.

Here are examples of reaction seeking behaviors:

1) using routines
2) talking about what you pocess
3) talking about who you know
4) any so called dhv
5) etc.

Using the above is actually a dlv. It shows that you are not a man of character and need external patches to give the illusion of character.

Here's the funny thing: routines get results, but the results you get reenforce the fact that you need outside things in order to make you attractive. This can never give us true confidence.

I know that this is hard to swallow, but A MAN OF CHARACTER DOESN'T NEED ANY DHV'S. HE IS ONE.

I don't quite agree with this. Just saying "be confident" and "improve your self-image" and "be high value" is not very helpful.

I think part of the difference is who you are trying to convince. If you're trying to improve your inner game, routines don't help at all because you know the game you're playing. But if you can pull off the act, routines will help impress women. One thing you may learn is that gosh, women aren't so scary after all, which in turn can improve confidence with women.

Mystery and others talk about "fake it till you make it." Meaning you use routines and outer game stuff (external patches you called them) temporarily, while also working on inner game and tailoring your persona to your best identity. After that you can discard the "training wheels" and be natural.

Inner game is extremely important, I won't disagree with that, but I don't think you can become an expert at pickup just with self-affirmations.

Vector,

Would you discuss how you see the game, and how the game fits in relation to the rest of your life?

-Sparks

This is a big question but I'll see what I can do. First how the game fits in relation to the rest of my life. The three big areas in life are health, wealth, and relationships. In health, I'm doing fine. I could probably stand to work out, but I'm doing alright. In wealth, I've put a fair amount of energy into my career and I am doing pretty well. In relationships, I have always been poor with women, even though I thought I had the attributes they say they want, "thoughtful, funny, successful, no criminal record, etc, blah blah blah." Women would sometimes choose me, but it was always the woman doing the choosing and my position was one of "take it or leave it." I was not the one in control.

Between health, wealth, and relationships, my life was out of balance. I decided I needed to put more time and energy into becoming better at relations with women.

I had always had a strongly negative attitude toward things that "shouldn't" matter, and this is one of the first things I had to change. These are things that shouldn't matter, but do. It's like when you go in for a job interview, whether you wear a suit or not has very little bearing on how well you will perform at the job. It "shouldn't" matter. But whether or not it should matter is not the question. It does matter.

When it comes to women there are things like hair cut or clothing that don't really have much to do with whether I'd be compatible with a woman in a relationship. There are also outer signs that suggest positive qualities but are not really positive by themselves, like having a screening frame and not a supplication frame.

Once I was able to let go of my focus on the things that "should" matter in courtship, I am able to focus on the things that do matter, even if they "shouldn't". I'm not above wearing a suit to a job interview. Likewise, I'll do what helps my game even if it's not "real" because the effects are real.

Canned openers are a great example. With an on-the-fly situational opener, I have trouble following up with a story that is sufficiently interesting, or I'll stumble through it and have trouble finding words, which makes me look uncomfortable (regardless of whether I am comfortable or not). With a canned opener, I've got it practiced well enough, it flows very well and I seem comfortable. And I am actually comfortable because I know where it's going to go.

Most of the benefit I get from studying the game has nothing to do with being fake or not because it's just good advice, like not buying girls drinks, or how to tell if she is into you, or what kind of frame to try to be in.

Sparks, the idea of power is a good concept to understand. True power comes from the confidence you possess. Both of you point out the importance of inner game, which I think many newcomers lose sight of when they jump into the art. These ideas, concepts, etc. that we share are all just tools to help expand on what you already have to offer. You should be an amazing guy to begin with, or at least have your life somewhat sorted out.

We are all self conscious in some sort of way, nobody is perfect. But what makes you a better, more attractive man is how you handle your imperfections while maximizing your strengths.

But like Vector points out, these are tools to help get your foot in the door with women. A lot of PUAs call it social calibration. The more you use the tools in the field, the more you understand what works and what doesn't, which in turn you calibrate to maximize on your dating potential.

Most importantly, you have to be in the field, getting yourself out there, to help calibrate.

Haha but maybe I'm just preaching to the choir.

Sparks, you make a good point. We have often taken different sides in this debate. To me, this is an A1 vs A3/C1 debate.

When you say, 'you become a dhv / your personality is a dhv' I think you are talking about a 'fully calibrated' person, whether that person is a PUA or not. I am somewhat opinionated, definitely take this as contribution to debate -- I neither get my personal worth tied up in my game, or in my discussion of topics.

I once read somewhere that the way people say "Fine, how are you?" is a preprogrammed, automatic response to "How are you?"...in other words it's canned material. I'm sure you can find other examples...people always ask, "Where are you from?" "Did you go to x high school?" The difference between this and a routine, is that

1) A routine is generally longer, which predisposes it to being more thought out, making the person delivering a routine more 'guilty' (guilty = social conditioning) than an AFC asking "Do you come here often?" rather than a GPUA asking "Who lies more?" and providing a backstory that he memorized before.

2) Routines get traded online, can contain lies, and are generally less 'personal.' Only the better PUAs know (I cannot even vouch for this yet) that time in the field will teach you to 1) improve your delivery, which most people know, and 2) imPROV your delivery, which means you can read a damn billboard on the way to the club and have an interesting question. It means you can hear a joke on the radio and pull an opener from it. It means you are free from the internet, the VAH, and all the trading that goes on in the community. This is another step of social calibration. Oh man, this post is going to be a novel

Canned material is meant to get people with bad bl, etc, into set. After that it's meant to deal with HB8.5+, SHB, girls w/ high bitch shields, etc. I have to stress again that this is about game, not about egos, I've run into alot of rhetoric about inner game that puts down canned material. I think it's all fine and good. To me, game is game, it's an answer to makeup, fake nails, $100 hair dressing, flashy clothes, and stiff, snobbish 'bitch shields.'

It's not a DLV. It's a hoop you jump through to get noticed, it's the same as companies not even wanting to talk to people wanting a job unless they have certain qualifications (certified xyz, college graduate with a 3.8 and above, internal reference, etc).

That doesn't mean anyone else who wants a job is DLVing because they fill out an application, it just means you can't always show up and expect people to 'like you for who you are.' Finally, and most importantly, using canned material, etc, is part of being calibrated. I'm not saying it must be used in all situations, but that there are certain situations where it just works better, and framing openers, FTCs, and A2 material as a DLV is just another way of saying any of the following.

1) I think people should like me for who I am 100% and that's it otherwise they are not worthy
2) I have no flexibility regarding how I choose to approach others
3) I came into this community with my socially conditioned ideas and can't think outside their box
4) Natural game is the only way to go, the only true way to go, etc
5) I do not understand the true meaning of A1 and A2 material
6) I think the only way to approach 'properly' (properly = social conditioning) is to go immediately into SOIing the girl (examples below)

....such as,
'Nice necklace, where did you get that? ... '
'Is that a pinot grigio or a syriah?...'
'This place is crowded tonight, huh? ... '
'What's a good looking woman like you doing... '
'Check out those hippies over there...(smirk), '

Finally, dude, this list continues, there are other reasons for a person thinking this is the only and best method of approaching. Bottom line, don't let your good conscience stop you from improving your game. Don't let your conscience sway other people's confidence in improving this area of their life.

kx192 wrote:I once read somewhere that the way people say "Fine, how are you?" is a preprogrammed, automatic response to "How are you?"...in other words it's canned material.

I'm actually trying to correct that. I'm trying to eliminate the rhetoric from my vocabulary. When someone asks me how I'm doing, I try to respond with something like, "I'm great! It's a beautiful day outside and I just bought a new watch. Check this out!" It's hard, because you don't realize how boring you are until you start trying to correct this type of behavior.

The seduction community has many presuppositions built into it. The fact that we need to learn a whole bunch of crap in order to lay a girl always presupposes that we need to qualify ourselves to the girl.

WE SHOULD BE THE ONES QUALIFYING GIRLS with real solid standards.

The fact that we have a whole bunch of secret lairs, presupposes that learning about pick up is a shameful thing. To me this shame is bullshit and it is something that hurts our inner game in the long run.

WE SHOULD BE PROUD AND IN LOVE WITH OURSELVES.

-Martin

Isn't it funny that almost all of the pick up gurus have nicknames. I'll probably get responses saying that pick up artists are like actors and that this is the way forums work. Blah, blah, blah.

-Martin

dude. I don't understand what you are getting at. Qualifying a girl is always how it works. The honest truth is that only some girls you might want are legitimate targets in any given night. The more girls you qualify (well) the quicker you will find the one that's ready for you. Who gives a crap what the opener is - once you connect with the girl then it's on. DHV is a tactic, used in conjunction with others, to open as many HB sets as effectively as possible. Real game starts once you are in comfort/attraction.

There is nothing secret about this lair any more than there is about a stock board for some company. Sex is a transaction I want the best possible return on. I get it when I focus on what is important. Some of the guys out there - the gurus - have put in years of their lives calibrating this shit. Watch them in action - as a friend - and you will see the power here.