Damn Nietzche.
Really, in certain situations some things are appropriate and some things are not. I don't think there's any disagreement on that. If "game" is understood to be a set of behaviors that you do in a nightclub on a friday night at 1:00 am, then in a doctors office those are inappropriate, but striking up a conversation in the right way is not inappropriate. It might come off as a little unusual, but not necessarily bad. Some people have friendly chatty stuff pouring out of their mouths 24/7, (like Professor, no offense) even at a doctors office, and as long as there is no schmoozing intent apparent, you should be fine. Logistics might suck, but if the mom loves you she could even encourage her 18+ year old daughter to go on a date.
Dallas PUA
The Pickup Artist Playground
When PUA sickness attacks...
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by Guest » Fri Dec 12, 2008 10:36 am
[quote1229095364=Finesse]Bull Run, Am I correct in assuming that by "would not force an interaction" that you feel conversing with people in a waiting room is just a no go in any form and that we should stick to just talking about our sickness to the nurses and staff?[/quote1229095364]
What I'm saying is that I wouldn't make it a point to talk to this girl at this moment in time. You're both sick and it seems highly inappropriate. The way I think about it is like this:
Very generally, there are two broad types of approaches:
1) A created approach. This is an approach that requires that you actively do something. I would say that an active approach actually requires you to physically move yourself into, or near, here personal space (note that space can be defined loosely, an email would be moving into her 'personal space' just as walking up to her would). In this case, you are FORCING an interaction. You are actively changing the world so as to ensure that you will at least talk to the girl.
2) An opportunistic approach. This approach is exactly what it sounds like, and is distinguished by the fact that you didn't actually do anything to create it. For example, the girl sits down one seat away. In this case, she has entered your personal space, of sorts. Since you are both in proximity to each other, you can use that proximity to opportunistically approach her. In this case, you lean over and sift through the mags on the coffee table in front of you two and say "they never have the mags I want...is Good Housekeeping so hard to subscribe to?"
In my opinion, the latter of the two approaches is ALWAYS socially acceptable. You are both in proximity and you have done nothing actively to open her, you just took advantage of the opportunity that the proximity has afforded you. Any normal, friendly person would do exactly the same thing. When you go out of your way to create proximity or enter someone's personal space or go on the 'offensive' then you start to bump up against social norms. In this case, I think the social norm is to keep to yourself. To not actively try to talk to people. Taking advantage of an opportunity is different though. I still think some people will be off put by it, but I don't think it's not totally socially unacceptable.
What I'm saying is that I wouldn't make it a point to talk to this girl at this moment in time. You're both sick and it seems highly inappropriate. The way I think about it is like this:
Very generally, there are two broad types of approaches:
1) A created approach. This is an approach that requires that you actively do something. I would say that an active approach actually requires you to physically move yourself into, or near, here personal space (note that space can be defined loosely, an email would be moving into her 'personal space' just as walking up to her would). In this case, you are FORCING an interaction. You are actively changing the world so as to ensure that you will at least talk to the girl.
2) An opportunistic approach. This approach is exactly what it sounds like, and is distinguished by the fact that you didn't actually do anything to create it. For example, the girl sits down one seat away. In this case, she has entered your personal space, of sorts. Since you are both in proximity to each other, you can use that proximity to opportunistically approach her. In this case, you lean over and sift through the mags on the coffee table in front of you two and say "they never have the mags I want...is Good Housekeeping so hard to subscribe to?"
In my opinion, the latter of the two approaches is ALWAYS socially acceptable. You are both in proximity and you have done nothing actively to open her, you just took advantage of the opportunity that the proximity has afforded you. Any normal, friendly person would do exactly the same thing. When you go out of your way to create proximity or enter someone's personal space or go on the 'offensive' then you start to bump up against social norms. In this case, I think the social norm is to keep to yourself. To not actively try to talk to people. Taking advantage of an opportunity is different though. I still think some people will be off put by it, but I don't think it's not totally socially unacceptable.
- Guest
by Guest » Fri Dec 12, 2008 12:21 pm
I guess what I am having a problem with is the term "force."
To me, when something is forced it is unwanted or undesirable.
I think there are 2 different types of forces that can be acting here.
Option 1: Forcing the interaction, (meaning that she is showing no visible signs of being attracted to you. AFTER you have come into proximity of her)
Option 2: Forcing the circumstances for an interaction (which to me is no different than what we already do on a regular basis, and is, for the most part, socially acceptable.)
The game came into the mix because guys weren't able to approach girls in a socially acceptable manner and would get blown out time after time, getting no where with women.
a scenario that plays out like this:
You: (looking for magazines walking around) "You know, they never have the magazine you want to read."
Her or the Mother: I know! I just bring my own.
Conversation ensues, but she could have said nothing. Social laws say that when you are addressed that it is the polite thing to do to respond, however, the body language always gives it away on whether or not they want to continue to talk to you.
Now, I'm not saying the transition from mundane talk to pillow talk would be easy, by all means, no. I'm saying that measuring their willingness to talk is part of life.
If she wants you to approach or has no immediately visible objections, are you still forcing the interaction?
To me, when something is forced it is unwanted or undesirable.
I think there are 2 different types of forces that can be acting here.
Option 1: Forcing the interaction, (meaning that she is showing no visible signs of being attracted to you. AFTER you have come into proximity of her)
Option 2: Forcing the circumstances for an interaction (which to me is no different than what we already do on a regular basis, and is, for the most part, socially acceptable.)
The game came into the mix because guys weren't able to approach girls in a socially acceptable manner and would get blown out time after time, getting no where with women.
a scenario that plays out like this:
You: (looking for magazines walking around) "You know, they never have the magazine you want to read."
Her or the Mother: I know! I just bring my own.
Conversation ensues, but she could have said nothing. Social laws say that when you are addressed that it is the polite thing to do to respond, however, the body language always gives it away on whether or not they want to continue to talk to you.
Now, I'm not saying the transition from mundane talk to pillow talk would be easy, by all means, no. I'm saying that measuring their willingness to talk is part of life.
If she wants you to approach or has no immediately visible objections, are you still forcing the interaction?
- Guest
by Guest » Fri Dec 12, 2008 1:21 pm
Finesse,
I don't have a problem initiating conversation. We're in agreement here. What I do have a problem with is going out of your way to initiate a conversation when it's not socially appropriate.
Keep in mind that knowing Game doesn't give you free reign to trample on social etiquette.
Listen man, you and I see eye to eye on a lot of stuff. I don't think we've ever really disagreed, but I don't understand why you would consider it to be OK to approach a chick in a doctor's office waiting room. It doesn't make any sense to me. You're sick, she's sick, you're in a place with sick people. I'm all for manipulating the world and creating your own Fate, but this seems like one of those times in which you remain cordial and aware of social norms. If Fate happens to shine on you, be opportunistic.
I'm not saying you 'turn off' your Game. What I am saying is that you need to remain calibrated and sensitive to the situation. Like I said, just because we know/have Game doesn't give us any right to no longer abide by the laws of our society.
I don't have a problem initiating conversation. We're in agreement here. What I do have a problem with is going out of your way to initiate a conversation when it's not socially appropriate.
Keep in mind that knowing Game doesn't give you free reign to trample on social etiquette.
Listen man, you and I see eye to eye on a lot of stuff. I don't think we've ever really disagreed, but I don't understand why you would consider it to be OK to approach a chick in a doctor's office waiting room. It doesn't make any sense to me. You're sick, she's sick, you're in a place with sick people. I'm all for manipulating the world and creating your own Fate, but this seems like one of those times in which you remain cordial and aware of social norms. If Fate happens to shine on you, be opportunistic.
I'm not saying you 'turn off' your Game. What I am saying is that you need to remain calibrated and sensitive to the situation. Like I said, just because we know/have Game doesn't give us any right to no longer abide by the laws of our society.
- Guest
by Guest » Fri Dec 12, 2008 3:12 pm
[quote1229112446=Bull Run]
It doesn't make any sense to me. You're sick, she's sick, you're in a place with sick people. I'm all for manipulating the world and creating your own Fate, but this seems like one of those times in which you remain cordial and aware of social norms. [b]If Fate happens to shine on you, be opportunistic[/b].
[/quote1229112446]
Agreed, pretty much. I don't typically force interactions like this (e.g. mother & 18yo in doctor office!).
Also, Finesse's idea to ask about a magazine or whatever IMO is fine and I have nothing against it at all because thats totally socially acceptable. I have enough experience to know where to put my time and energy and where to screen something out. This would be a case of the latter for me. JMHO. I'd probably be creatively texting legitimate girl(s) as a better use of my time. Or writing posts for you bums.
It doesn't make any sense to me. You're sick, she's sick, you're in a place with sick people. I'm all for manipulating the world and creating your own Fate, but this seems like one of those times in which you remain cordial and aware of social norms. [b]If Fate happens to shine on you, be opportunistic[/b].
[/quote1229112446]
Agreed, pretty much. I don't typically force interactions like this (e.g. mother & 18yo in doctor office!).
Also, Finesse's idea to ask about a magazine or whatever IMO is fine and I have nothing against it at all because thats totally socially acceptable. I have enough experience to know where to put my time and energy and where to screen something out. This would be a case of the latter for me. JMHO. I'd probably be creatively texting legitimate girl(s) as a better use of my time. Or writing posts for you bums.
- Guest
by Guest » Fri Dec 12, 2008 3:38 pm
Flip it around...if you felt like utter shit and were sitting in a doctors office...would you want some random chick hitting on you? What if you weren't there for the flu or a common cold...but like some weird growth on your unmentionables? Would you wanna talk about "who lies more, men or women?"
I know I wouldn't.
I know I wouldn't.
- Guest
by Guest » Fri Dec 12, 2008 4:06 pm
I only go to the doctor if I am pretty much on my death bed. I hate the doctor's office. So if I am there and someone talks to me I would pretty much be ready to tell them to fuck off.
Have a feeling the girl would have felt the same way. Unless of course she was just there for a checkup or something easy and she felt great. But I doubt this was the case.
Have a feeling the girl would have felt the same way. Unless of course she was just there for a checkup or something easy and she felt great. But I doubt this was the case.
- Guest
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