I understand the concept of not selling yourself out, but calibration is still an important and effective mechanism.
Take for example presenting a technical topic to different groups of people. In order for your message to be as effective as possible you need to calibrate to your audience. You present something technical in a technical fashion to a bunch of business majors and they'll likely be confused and not interested. You present that same technical presentation in a non-technical fashion to a bunch of engineering majors and they'll likely be bored and consider you a waste of their time. However, properly calibrated the presenter can get his point across to both groups with out changing who he is or the message he is trying to convey.
I wish I could be straight up who I am 100pct of the time, but because of the way the world is I can't. The general population is not strong enough to take the true "uncle Howie" 100pct of the time. There are far too many candy ass wusses out there who can't handle reality. So for me to communicate effectively with others I have to calibrate to the audience I am conversing with in order to have successful communications.
Dallas PUA
The Pickup Artist Playground
Rugged Individualism
41 posts
• Page 2 of 5 • 1, 2, 3, 4, 5
by Guest » Mon Mar 30, 2009 11:17 am
Sure I get the concept of being an individual inside a whole community, and even I adhere to it, but there is still and will always be a social agenda, in a society (whether it's the USA, or this one) that you have to adhere to (so long as you see it going the right way).
I respect you pushing rugged individualism, but this particular community has been primarily set up for those people that are just coming into this realization. And although I agree that a certain amount of individualism is needed, one thing you absolutely cannot do, in a society, is eliminate the need for social etiquette and social calibration. Especially in a society that 1) demands it, and 2) will shut you out entirely. (I am talking about the society of the world not Dallaslair here)
Telling people who just get into this, who are socially awkward, have no social skills, who played WOW and did get a fleeting moment of inner James Bond, and realized that in the worldly scheme of things that they don't have it all "together", that they should not be afraid to stand up and say "I play WOW.", is a little bit on the "beating yourself in the head with a book" level. The values they have, that you are telling them to stand up and tell them they should embrace, are the same values that brought them here to change.
Bull Run, I have no doubt of your skills and your personal growth, but I urge you to, if nothing else, think about this: They need to understand the basics and the rules to communicating with this society (the social world, club scene, social networking) before they can be a rugged individual within that society.
So are we even talking about the people of this community? OR are we talking about the WOW community or any other community where its members are happy there?
I thought that's why we were here?
I respect you pushing rugged individualism, but this particular community has been primarily set up for those people that are just coming into this realization. And although I agree that a certain amount of individualism is needed, one thing you absolutely cannot do, in a society, is eliminate the need for social etiquette and social calibration. Especially in a society that 1) demands it, and 2) will shut you out entirely. (I am talking about the society of the world not Dallaslair here)
Telling people who just get into this, who are socially awkward, have no social skills, who played WOW and did get a fleeting moment of inner James Bond, and realized that in the worldly scheme of things that they don't have it all "together", that they should not be afraid to stand up and say "I play WOW.", is a little bit on the "beating yourself in the head with a book" level. The values they have, that you are telling them to stand up and tell them they should embrace, are the same values that brought them here to change.
Bull Run, I have no doubt of your skills and your personal growth, but I urge you to, if nothing else, think about this: They need to understand the basics and the rules to communicating with this society (the social world, club scene, social networking) before they can be a rugged individual within that society.
So are we even talking about the people of this community? OR are we talking about the WOW community or any other community where its members are happy there?
I thought that's why we were here?
- Guest
by Guest » Mon Mar 30, 2009 11:34 am
[quote1238425837=Vector]As far as what are you giving up to increase your odds, you are learning a skill. Perhaps the skill is listening, not just to what is said but what is not said. Or the skill is reading body language and facial expressions. It's like many other skills, you don't have to give up your soul or any piece of who you are. But you may have to give up some World of Warcraft.[/quote1238425837]
I see your point, but I just don't process it that way.
To your point Vector. Yes, I think everyone can improve themselves on the fringes. We all know how important BL, tonality, vocal projection, sentence construction, and non-verbal cues are. These are all small things that make a HUGE difference. But, they are still fringe things.
Further, I think if you embrace the idea of not apologizing for who you are then all of these things magically improve themselves.
To the overall point though, I'm not saying calibration is not completely and totally a bad thing. In it's most basic form, calibration is tact. Sometimes, some situations require one to be tactful. In this case, you're trying to keep a social situation pleasant, and to me that's just something this is required in a civil society such as ours.
When I think calibration I think of it as a more insidious activity. You hear guys say things like, I didn't calibrate enough. Well, what does that mean exactly? Were you being yourself too much? Were you saying/doing things that you thought she would respond favorably to but did not? But, we all have our style. There are a handful of guys on here that I don't think calibrate themselves much at all, they do really well with women, and have fun doing so.
In my opinion, calibration should be something that you do without thinking. Once you start thinking it no longer makes it real. It becomes fake and you do sell yourself out a little bit because instead of being natural and acting within the confines of who you are, you could potentially be trying to be someone else.
I've always kind of been that person that just goes out in the world and does whatever makes sense to me. A lot of times I was totally wrong, a lot of times. But, I always striven to understand why things played out the way they did. Believe what you believe, interact with the world, then process the feedback. If it was good feedback, then repeat, if not, then you need to find a way to fix those items.
I see your point, but I just don't process it that way.
To your point Vector. Yes, I think everyone can improve themselves on the fringes. We all know how important BL, tonality, vocal projection, sentence construction, and non-verbal cues are. These are all small things that make a HUGE difference. But, they are still fringe things.
Further, I think if you embrace the idea of not apologizing for who you are then all of these things magically improve themselves.
To the overall point though, I'm not saying calibration is not completely and totally a bad thing. In it's most basic form, calibration is tact. Sometimes, some situations require one to be tactful. In this case, you're trying to keep a social situation pleasant, and to me that's just something this is required in a civil society such as ours.
When I think calibration I think of it as a more insidious activity. You hear guys say things like, I didn't calibrate enough. Well, what does that mean exactly? Were you being yourself too much? Were you saying/doing things that you thought she would respond favorably to but did not? But, we all have our style. There are a handful of guys on here that I don't think calibrate themselves much at all, they do really well with women, and have fun doing so.
In my opinion, calibration should be something that you do without thinking. Once you start thinking it no longer makes it real. It becomes fake and you do sell yourself out a little bit because instead of being natural and acting within the confines of who you are, you could potentially be trying to be someone else.
I've always kind of been that person that just goes out in the world and does whatever makes sense to me. A lot of times I was totally wrong, a lot of times. But, I always striven to understand why things played out the way they did. Believe what you believe, interact with the world, then process the feedback. If it was good feedback, then repeat, if not, then you need to find a way to fix those items.
- Guest
by Guest » Mon Mar 30, 2009 12:00 pm
[quote1238431033=Finesse]Sure I get the concept of being an individual inside a whole community, and even I adhere to it, but there is still and will always be a social agenda, in a society (whether it's the USA, or this one) that you have to adhere to (so long as you see it going the right way).
I respect you pushing rugged individualism, but this particular community has been primarily set up for those people that are just coming into this realization. And although I agree that a certain amount of individualism is needed, one thing you absolutely cannot do, in a society, is eliminate the need for social etiquette and social calibration. Especially in a society that 1) demands it, and 2) will shut you out entirely. (I am talking about the society of the world not Dallaslair here)
Telling people who just get into this, who are socially awkward, have no social skills, who played WOW and did get a fleeting moment of inner James Bond, and realized that in the worldly scheme of things that they don't have it all "together", that they should not be afraid to stand up and say "I play WOW.", is a little bit on the "beating yourself in the head with a book" level. The values they have, that you are telling them to stand up and tell them they should embrace, are the same values that brought them here to change.
Bull Run, I have no doubt of your skills and your personal growth, but I urge you to, if nothing else, think about this: They need to understand the basics and the rules to communicating with this society (the social world, club scene, social networking) before they can be a rugged individual within that society.
So are we even talking about the people of this community? OR are we talking about the WOW community or any other community where its members are happy there?
I thought that's why we were here?[/quote1238431033]
First, I think it should be implied that we all have a duty to read and understand the basics of PU. Which, think can be accomplished through reading over a short period of time. You may not know how to put the basics in action, but they should have done some level of homework before going out to play.
I'm not advocating sending a complete and total social misfit to the wolves. No, no. That would be too traumatic. Instead, I'm advocating that people join our community but understand that they are ultimately responsible for their growth. They are in control.
Absolutely they should continue to value what they value, even if it doesn't fit into the confines of normal society. But, they have to understand, and I think the mere presence of wanting to change does this, they they now have to understand what the rest of society values and then embrace those as well.
It is as simple as going out and just doing it, but it's also not that simple at all. But, it's the first step. Doing it is the first step (after a little bit of reading, which I assume is why they're here anyway). The doing will pull them forward. The reason? Because they'll more than likely fail. So, they need to understand why. Then begins the cycle of try, analyze feedback, retool or make changes, then try again.
It's a simple formula that starts with doing and centers around you as a person.
If someone is happy in their community, they will more than likely not seek out another community to be a part of. The WOW community is probably full of guys that are happy being who they are, so let them be. Who cares if it's in a pathetic community? You're happy.
What I'm talking about are the people here. We all have decided to make a change, but that's not enough. Now, you have to go out and DO. You have to understand that it really kind of is you against the world. We can help and support, but your the one that grows, you are the one that changes.
I embraced the idea of not apologizing for who I was, but that doesn't mean that I stopped growing. It just meant that I had nothing to be ashamed of. Sure, I still said and did stupid shit. But, I'll be damned if someone else is going to make me feel bad because I did or didn't do something that didn't fit in their value system.
In the end, Finesse, I think you have this idea that the guys that come here are socially inept. Well, where are these guys man? Probably lurkers and won't do what's necessary to change, which to me means that they're happy enough with their lot in life. The vast majority that come here and start to do the work necessary to change are nothing of the sort. I've only met 3 - 4 guys that I would consider to be vastly socially awkward, but I think the same principles apply to them...they just need a lot longer to make the change.
I respect you pushing rugged individualism, but this particular community has been primarily set up for those people that are just coming into this realization. And although I agree that a certain amount of individualism is needed, one thing you absolutely cannot do, in a society, is eliminate the need for social etiquette and social calibration. Especially in a society that 1) demands it, and 2) will shut you out entirely. (I am talking about the society of the world not Dallaslair here)
Telling people who just get into this, who are socially awkward, have no social skills, who played WOW and did get a fleeting moment of inner James Bond, and realized that in the worldly scheme of things that they don't have it all "together", that they should not be afraid to stand up and say "I play WOW.", is a little bit on the "beating yourself in the head with a book" level. The values they have, that you are telling them to stand up and tell them they should embrace, are the same values that brought them here to change.
Bull Run, I have no doubt of your skills and your personal growth, but I urge you to, if nothing else, think about this: They need to understand the basics and the rules to communicating with this society (the social world, club scene, social networking) before they can be a rugged individual within that society.
So are we even talking about the people of this community? OR are we talking about the WOW community or any other community where its members are happy there?
I thought that's why we were here?[/quote1238431033]
First, I think it should be implied that we all have a duty to read and understand the basics of PU. Which, think can be accomplished through reading over a short period of time. You may not know how to put the basics in action, but they should have done some level of homework before going out to play.
I'm not advocating sending a complete and total social misfit to the wolves. No, no. That would be too traumatic. Instead, I'm advocating that people join our community but understand that they are ultimately responsible for their growth. They are in control.
Absolutely they should continue to value what they value, even if it doesn't fit into the confines of normal society. But, they have to understand, and I think the mere presence of wanting to change does this, they they now have to understand what the rest of society values and then embrace those as well.
It is as simple as going out and just doing it, but it's also not that simple at all. But, it's the first step. Doing it is the first step (after a little bit of reading, which I assume is why they're here anyway). The doing will pull them forward. The reason? Because they'll more than likely fail. So, they need to understand why. Then begins the cycle of try, analyze feedback, retool or make changes, then try again.
It's a simple formula that starts with doing and centers around you as a person.
If someone is happy in their community, they will more than likely not seek out another community to be a part of. The WOW community is probably full of guys that are happy being who they are, so let them be. Who cares if it's in a pathetic community? You're happy.
What I'm talking about are the people here. We all have decided to make a change, but that's not enough. Now, you have to go out and DO. You have to understand that it really kind of is you against the world. We can help and support, but your the one that grows, you are the one that changes.
I embraced the idea of not apologizing for who I was, but that doesn't mean that I stopped growing. It just meant that I had nothing to be ashamed of. Sure, I still said and did stupid shit. But, I'll be damned if someone else is going to make me feel bad because I did or didn't do something that didn't fit in their value system.
In the end, Finesse, I think you have this idea that the guys that come here are socially inept. Well, where are these guys man? Probably lurkers and won't do what's necessary to change, which to me means that they're happy enough with their lot in life. The vast majority that come here and start to do the work necessary to change are nothing of the sort. I've only met 3 - 4 guys that I would consider to be vastly socially awkward, but I think the same principles apply to them...they just need a lot longer to make the change.
- Guest
by Guest » Mon Mar 30, 2009 12:30 pm
Im not saying that all that come here are losers, I am saying that we all aren't 100% on social etiquette and even though you hate the word, calibration. We all do things that society views as unacceptable, and what I am saying is the we MUST understand and calibrate based to what OUR goals are. Because how we act determines whether or not people will or won't do something for us.
Sigh... Since you called me out..
With the exception to Professor (I have never witnessed or even perceived him violating), I could call us all out on a social violation or one or two, the fact that I merely indicated that I could call someone out is a violation in and of itself.
To get what you want in a social world a certain amount calibration is needed, to lead people, a certain amount of respect.
I relate this to math, Calculus v. geometry... Geometry is pretty simple to me calculus not so much. Sure I can learn how to work an advanced calculus problem but will I understand how it works and or why it works? Probably not. So what type of education are we promoting here?
Sigh... Since you called me out..
With the exception to Professor (I have never witnessed or even perceived him violating), I could call us all out on a social violation or one or two, the fact that I merely indicated that I could call someone out is a violation in and of itself.
To get what you want in a social world a certain amount calibration is needed, to lead people, a certain amount of respect.
I relate this to math, Calculus v. geometry... Geometry is pretty simple to me calculus not so much. Sure I can learn how to work an advanced calculus problem but will I understand how it works and or why it works? Probably not. So what type of education are we promoting here?
- Guest
by Guest » Mon Mar 30, 2009 2:16 pm
[quote1238440233=Finesse]
We all do things that society views as unacceptable, and what I am saying is the we MUST understand and calibrate based to what OUR goals are. Because how we act determines whether or not people will or won't do something for us.
[/quote1238440233]
Bingo, very important if you want to be successful in life. Other things that come to mind along the same lines are first impressions and perception.
BR- take for example your job........while at work, don't you have to calibrate some to get what you want so you can be perceived in a positive manner?
We all do things that society views as unacceptable, and what I am saying is the we MUST understand and calibrate based to what OUR goals are. Because how we act determines whether or not people will or won't do something for us.
[/quote1238440233]
Bingo, very important if you want to be successful in life. Other things that come to mind along the same lines are first impressions and perception.
BR- take for example your job........while at work, don't you have to calibrate some to get what you want so you can be perceived in a positive manner?
- Guest
by Guest » Mon Mar 30, 2009 2:35 pm
[quote1238438740=Finesse]Im not saying that all that come here are losers, I am saying that we all aren't 100% on social etiquette and even though you hate the word, calibration. We all do things that society views as unacceptable, and what I am saying is the we MUST understand and calibrate based to what OUR goals are. Because how we act determines whether or not people will or won't do something for us.[/quote1238438740]
And doing something for us means what exactly? Mow your lawn, do your laundry, give you a promotion, suck your dick? I don't ever think that I got someone to do something for me, I think this person wanted to do something for me because I'm fucking awesome. It's a small difference, but it's world's a part.
[quote1238438740=Finesse]With the exception to Professor (I have never witnessed or even perceived him violating), I could call us all out on a social violation or one or two, the fact that I merely indicated that I could call someone out is a violation in and of itself.[/quote1238438740]
I don't think this is a violation at all. Say what you will. Not doing so would be a violation to you. Which is more important? Staying true to you or to the community? Fact is that if our community was more focused on individualism then no one would ever perceive a 'call out' as a social violation.
And, what's wrong with violating social norms on occasion? I do it all the time, so do you, and I assure you Professor does as well. We are human man, we will always violate social norms. The key is to understand when you do and then to determine if it is something that you need to change about yourself.
Further, actually violating a social norm and being told to not violate a social norm are two totally different things. There is virtue in experience. This is why doing is so important, even if you fuck it up beyond belief. Fucking up how is you learn man.
I will say that calibration does occur, but it does so over time as we interact with the world and do not achieve or get what we want. We recognize our failures and then we tweak ourselves, but we do so primarily on the fringes, and we do it in a universal sense. In other words, I'm changing myself in this any any other situation, not changing in a specific situation to suit someone's desire.
[quote1238438740=Finesse]I relate this to math, Calculus v. geometry... Geometry is pretty simple to me calculus not so much. Sure I can learn how to work an advanced calculus problem but will I understand how it works and or why it works? Probably not. So what type of education are we promoting here?[/quote1238438740]
Are we promoting an education?
Who likes politicians? These people are the ultimate calibrators. Their success is entirely based on tweaking their views to conform to popular sentiment, even when popular sentiment is wrong or goes against the politician's core belief system. Politicians look at the world and think here's what I want, now how can I get what I want from other people? This type of thinking objectifies everyone. People become nothing more than a means to fulfilling some kind of end. And, in order to fulfill that end the politician routinely has to talk out of both sides of his mouth.
I prefer to think of the world slightly differently. Here's who I am. Here's what I believe. Here's what I want. Now, I'm going to go out into the world and find what I want.
And doing something for us means what exactly? Mow your lawn, do your laundry, give you a promotion, suck your dick? I don't ever think that I got someone to do something for me, I think this person wanted to do something for me because I'm fucking awesome. It's a small difference, but it's world's a part.
[quote1238438740=Finesse]With the exception to Professor (I have never witnessed or even perceived him violating), I could call us all out on a social violation or one or two, the fact that I merely indicated that I could call someone out is a violation in and of itself.[/quote1238438740]
I don't think this is a violation at all. Say what you will. Not doing so would be a violation to you. Which is more important? Staying true to you or to the community? Fact is that if our community was more focused on individualism then no one would ever perceive a 'call out' as a social violation.
And, what's wrong with violating social norms on occasion? I do it all the time, so do you, and I assure you Professor does as well. We are human man, we will always violate social norms. The key is to understand when you do and then to determine if it is something that you need to change about yourself.
Further, actually violating a social norm and being told to not violate a social norm are two totally different things. There is virtue in experience. This is why doing is so important, even if you fuck it up beyond belief. Fucking up how is you learn man.
I will say that calibration does occur, but it does so over time as we interact with the world and do not achieve or get what we want. We recognize our failures and then we tweak ourselves, but we do so primarily on the fringes, and we do it in a universal sense. In other words, I'm changing myself in this any any other situation, not changing in a specific situation to suit someone's desire.
[quote1238438740=Finesse]I relate this to math, Calculus v. geometry... Geometry is pretty simple to me calculus not so much. Sure I can learn how to work an advanced calculus problem but will I understand how it works and or why it works? Probably not. So what type of education are we promoting here?[/quote1238438740]
Are we promoting an education?
Who likes politicians? These people are the ultimate calibrators. Their success is entirely based on tweaking their views to conform to popular sentiment, even when popular sentiment is wrong or goes against the politician's core belief system. Politicians look at the world and think here's what I want, now how can I get what I want from other people? This type of thinking objectifies everyone. People become nothing more than a means to fulfilling some kind of end. And, in order to fulfill that end the politician routinely has to talk out of both sides of his mouth.
I prefer to think of the world slightly differently. Here's who I am. Here's what I believe. Here's what I want. Now, I'm going to go out into the world and find what I want.
- Guest
by Guest » Mon Mar 30, 2009 2:41 pm
[quote1238441847=UncleHOwie]
[quote1238440233=Finesse]
We all do things that society views as unacceptable, and what I am saying is the we MUST understand and calibrate based to what OUR goals are. Because how we act determines whether or not people will or won't do something for us.
[/quote1238440233]
Bingo, very important if you want to be successful in life. Other things that come to mind along the same lines are first impressions and perception.
BR- take for example your job........while at work, don't you have to calibrate some to get what you want so you can be perceived in a positive manner?
[/quote1238441847]
I suppose I make a distinction between my professional life and my personal life. In my professional life, I do sell myself out a bit. But, that's part of the deal. You give me money, in return I agree to conform to your requirements of me.
What I'm talking about is social relationships outside of professional places.
Too often, guys make a similar agreement. You give me pussy, and I agree to conform to your requirements of me.
When I say calibration sucks I mean in a social sense. When I roll up to a girl, she's going to get me 100%. I will not conform to her world just because I want to fuck her. Period.
I suppose that we were all under the understanding that I was essentially referring to social situations, not professional settings.
[quote1238440233=Finesse]
We all do things that society views as unacceptable, and what I am saying is the we MUST understand and calibrate based to what OUR goals are. Because how we act determines whether or not people will or won't do something for us.
[/quote1238440233]
Bingo, very important if you want to be successful in life. Other things that come to mind along the same lines are first impressions and perception.
BR- take for example your job........while at work, don't you have to calibrate some to get what you want so you can be perceived in a positive manner?
[/quote1238441847]
I suppose I make a distinction between my professional life and my personal life. In my professional life, I do sell myself out a bit. But, that's part of the deal. You give me money, in return I agree to conform to your requirements of me.
What I'm talking about is social relationships outside of professional places.
Too often, guys make a similar agreement. You give me pussy, and I agree to conform to your requirements of me.
When I say calibration sucks I mean in a social sense. When I roll up to a girl, she's going to get me 100%. I will not conform to her world just because I want to fuck her. Period.
I suppose that we were all under the understanding that I was essentially referring to social situations, not professional settings.
- Guest
by Guest » Mon Mar 30, 2009 3:21 pm
Well, here's a thread full of amazing information that is going to be over the head of 80% of those who check this board.
The way I see it, the PoV B R is coming from on this is the one he comes from on every topic he ever feels passionate about...the extreme. This is one of the things I love about you. Like you said, you take it extreme...some of us throw out a moderate view, and some how we all meet in the middle of that. : )
The examples you give, the overall tone of the thoughts, theories, and examples you give are taken from the extreme definition of each "pickup" term. You refer to peacocking as wearing the big fuzzy pink top hat and clown shoes...you speak of calibration as if we are all going to conform to wearing shirt/tie corporate attire, call each other Mr. Smith, and live much like they did in the Stepford Wife movie. The fact is, as with every skill/lession taught in the popular methodologies, the examples given are exaggerated to get the point across to a broad range of readers. Mystery himself is a 6'7" exaggeration of a person.
The concept of peacocking is to add a [b]BIT[/b] of flair to one's normal style that can/will make him/her stand out. Like when you wear your normal shirt/tie combo out...mind you you have a proper sense of style so their is a variance of color in your wardrobe...but for a little extra flair you toss on a fedora. This fedora is within the social norm, most American men under utilize the fashion accessory that is the hat, and therefore you stick out a bit. You're not outlandish with it...you could wear that outfit to the bar or to a work luncheon. Now, would you wear what you wore on St. Patrick's Day to that same work luncheon? No. The social norm on St. Patties day it to be outlandish and green...and you did so with your green fuzzy hat. That right there is you calibrating to the situation. You aren't 100% conformed to the way of the Borg, you loosely fit in to what is socially acceptable.
Post like this enable people like Westfall in to believing everything they do is a-okay. "Well, I have news for you, Walter Cronkite...you aren't." Sorry, had to throw that in there...watching Zoolander right now. You can still be yourself...every bit of yourself...and still calibrate to sitations you are in and be socially aware. Again, you only start to lose yourself if you take this all to the extreme. To validate the points exactly as you are bringing them across in your writing, you have to have a binary way of thinking. All on, or all off. In these two advanced topics, there are a multitude of levels. I think this whole thread should have some preface to that. Those who know you know how to read it. Those who don't might take this to the far end of the spectrum and turn in to the poster boy of Asshatery...and nothing good will become of that!
The way I see it, the PoV B R is coming from on this is the one he comes from on every topic he ever feels passionate about...the extreme. This is one of the things I love about you. Like you said, you take it extreme...some of us throw out a moderate view, and some how we all meet in the middle of that. : )
The examples you give, the overall tone of the thoughts, theories, and examples you give are taken from the extreme definition of each "pickup" term. You refer to peacocking as wearing the big fuzzy pink top hat and clown shoes...you speak of calibration as if we are all going to conform to wearing shirt/tie corporate attire, call each other Mr. Smith, and live much like they did in the Stepford Wife movie. The fact is, as with every skill/lession taught in the popular methodologies, the examples given are exaggerated to get the point across to a broad range of readers. Mystery himself is a 6'7" exaggeration of a person.
The concept of peacocking is to add a [b]BIT[/b] of flair to one's normal style that can/will make him/her stand out. Like when you wear your normal shirt/tie combo out...mind you you have a proper sense of style so their is a variance of color in your wardrobe...but for a little extra flair you toss on a fedora. This fedora is within the social norm, most American men under utilize the fashion accessory that is the hat, and therefore you stick out a bit. You're not outlandish with it...you could wear that outfit to the bar or to a work luncheon. Now, would you wear what you wore on St. Patrick's Day to that same work luncheon? No. The social norm on St. Patties day it to be outlandish and green...and you did so with your green fuzzy hat. That right there is you calibrating to the situation. You aren't 100% conformed to the way of the Borg, you loosely fit in to what is socially acceptable.
Post like this enable people like Westfall in to believing everything they do is a-okay. "Well, I have news for you, Walter Cronkite...you aren't." Sorry, had to throw that in there...watching Zoolander right now. You can still be yourself...every bit of yourself...and still calibrate to sitations you are in and be socially aware. Again, you only start to lose yourself if you take this all to the extreme. To validate the points exactly as you are bringing them across in your writing, you have to have a binary way of thinking. All on, or all off. In these two advanced topics, there are a multitude of levels. I think this whole thread should have some preface to that. Those who know you know how to read it. Those who don't might take this to the far end of the spectrum and turn in to the poster boy of Asshatery...and nothing good will become of that!
- Guest
by Guest » Mon Mar 30, 2009 4:55 pm
Smirks, bravo my friend.
You're right. I am taking the extreme view point. I often do this because we all tend to hide behind the notion of shades of gray. In reality, we are governed by the gray, and we have to act accordingly. But, do not let that stop you from believing and thinking in black and white.
Yes, I acknowledge that we have to work within the confines of social norms. This is a given. We all know that. But, for those of us that have been crushed by social norms for so long, don't you think it might be healthy to fight back for a little while?
I do. Sometimes you have to get a jab in every now and again. So, when I say don't be afraid to violate a social norm from time to time, that means don't be afraid to do it, just know that you're doing it.
Smirks, you did it the other day in Denton with that old, blonde lady dancing in the cage. You told her she was grossing you out and she had to leave. That was a violation, but you weren't afraid to do it because you weren't afraid to point out something that you thought was a violation. Calibrating in this situation was not needed and it wasn't the best medicine.
The peacocking example was a great way of articulating the message. I attempt to do something, everyday, that makes me stand out as an individual. When I go out, I dress to conform. Then, I add something that makes me stand out. Something most others would not be wearing. The other night it was a fedora, at St Patty's it was girl's, hat with a built in tiara, in Fort Worth it's bandanna's on my boots.
The point is to embrace the things that are different about you and use them to your advantage. Show the world, without apology. Doing this will naturally mean that sometimes you violate social norms, the key is to understand when you've taken things too far.
As for the WF comment, I thought of this while I was writing it. But, I knew a couple of things would prevent this: 1) there would be a dissenting opinion that would keep everyone in check, especially newer guys, 2) WF is a sociopath, and 3) the truly oblivious wouldn't understand enough of what was said to actually put it in action.
The best way to make a point is to take it to the extreme.
Generally speaking, people tend to think in black and white...but, like I said, we live in the world of the gray. I just gave you the perspective of the 'all or nothing' crowd. The boundaries have been defined, now we can have a discussion on getting a better grip on the quest to remain an individual while living in a world that, tends, to stamp that out.
[A preface to this may be a good idea Smirks. Also, note that when I'm talking about this I'm generally speaking about the social world. In a professional sense, being different isn't really that beneficial because of the premium put on being a member of a team.]
You're right. I am taking the extreme view point. I often do this because we all tend to hide behind the notion of shades of gray. In reality, we are governed by the gray, and we have to act accordingly. But, do not let that stop you from believing and thinking in black and white.
Yes, I acknowledge that we have to work within the confines of social norms. This is a given. We all know that. But, for those of us that have been crushed by social norms for so long, don't you think it might be healthy to fight back for a little while?
I do. Sometimes you have to get a jab in every now and again. So, when I say don't be afraid to violate a social norm from time to time, that means don't be afraid to do it, just know that you're doing it.
Smirks, you did it the other day in Denton with that old, blonde lady dancing in the cage. You told her she was grossing you out and she had to leave. That was a violation, but you weren't afraid to do it because you weren't afraid to point out something that you thought was a violation. Calibrating in this situation was not needed and it wasn't the best medicine.
The peacocking example was a great way of articulating the message. I attempt to do something, everyday, that makes me stand out as an individual. When I go out, I dress to conform. Then, I add something that makes me stand out. Something most others would not be wearing. The other night it was a fedora, at St Patty's it was girl's, hat with a built in tiara, in Fort Worth it's bandanna's on my boots.
The point is to embrace the things that are different about you and use them to your advantage. Show the world, without apology. Doing this will naturally mean that sometimes you violate social norms, the key is to understand when you've taken things too far.
As for the WF comment, I thought of this while I was writing it. But, I knew a couple of things would prevent this: 1) there would be a dissenting opinion that would keep everyone in check, especially newer guys, 2) WF is a sociopath, and 3) the truly oblivious wouldn't understand enough of what was said to actually put it in action.
The best way to make a point is to take it to the extreme.
Generally speaking, people tend to think in black and white...but, like I said, we live in the world of the gray. I just gave you the perspective of the 'all or nothing' crowd. The boundaries have been defined, now we can have a discussion on getting a better grip on the quest to remain an individual while living in a world that, tends, to stamp that out.
[A preface to this may be a good idea Smirks. Also, note that when I'm talking about this I'm generally speaking about the social world. In a professional sense, being different isn't really that beneficial because of the premium put on being a member of a team.]
- Guest
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